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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
These are global sales not UK only - and include deliveries of all the pre-ordered vehicles for most world markets.

Back in June they were saying "30,000 order bank globally already. That really means we’re effectively sold out for the balance of this calendar year and it’s been a super response, pretty much everything we would have expected and more, actually."

So that means they delivered 9,813 in Q2 and have 20,187 to deliver in Q3? Something does not seem right there?

Production issues or have these sales evapourated?
Post #862638 20th Oct 2020 5:54pm
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markb110



Member Since: 22 May 2010
Location: Guildford
Posts: 2504

England 2002 Defender 90 Td5 HT Epsom Green
Wont be long before one certain country starts buying up the planet one business at a time...... Big Cry
Post #862661 20th Oct 2020 7:07pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
Interesting to see the quarterly split, and things went backwards in August?



Click image to enlarge
Post #863823 27th Oct 2020 1:47pm
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Tim in Scotland



Member Since: 23 May 2007
Location: The Land that time forgot
Posts: 3748

 
Could be because most of Europe shuts down for its summer break in August so only minimal workforce available. We used to dread having to make repairs or even dry dock from mid July through to mid September as many engineering works had only skeleton staff on call and nowhere near a full workforce available.

Another UK sale notched up today.......... the guy who delivers coal to the house across the courtyard from mine stopped me this morning and told me he has ordered a 90 to replace his aging 110. Didn’t say which spec but he did say he loves the Pangea Green with contrast roof. Pangea Green D250 90 HSE with Air Suspension, Off-road Pack, Towing Pack, Black Contrast roof , rear recovery eyes, Front bash plate, Classic flaps all round, extended wheel arch kit and a few bits from PowerfulUK Expel Clear Gloss PPF to come
2020 D240 1st Edition in Pangea Green with Acorn interior. Now gone - old faithful, no mechanical issues whatsoever ever but the leaks and rattles all over the place won’t be missed!
Post #863825 27th Oct 2020 1:51pm
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Cheshire110



Member Since: 26 Jul 2013
Location: Cheshire/London
Posts: 2718

United Kingdom 
Supacat wrote:
Interesting to see the quarterly split, and things went backwards in August?



Click image to enlarge


Normal seasonal shape I’d have thought... people wait for the new plate. Cheers, David
Land Rovers of all shapes S3 onwards… Daily is a 110 V8.
Post #863857 27th Oct 2020 3:47pm
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lohr500



Member Since: 14 Sep 2014
Location: Skipton
Posts: 1277

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Santorini Black
Any idea what the difference is between retails and wholesales? Could the high Sept wholesale spike be a raft of dealer 1st registrations as they get pushed into taking their quotas?
Post #863860 27th Oct 2020 3:58pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
Cheshire110 wrote:
Supacat wrote:
Interesting to see the quarterly split, and things went backwards in August?



Click image to enlarge


Normal seasonal shape I’d have thought... people wait for the new plate.


UK yes, but don't forget that these are global sales, so I don't think that explains it, unless other markets got no vehicles, and there's always inventory from the earlier months.

lohr500 wrote:
Any idea what the difference is between retails and wholesales? Could the high Sept wholesale spike be a raft of dealer 1st registrations as they get pushed into taking their quotas?


Every retail sale has to be first wholesaled to the dealer first. I'd have thought it's just normal inventory flowing through. Not forgetting that JLR have stated that the final two quarters of production was required to fulfil orders placed. So it should all be flowing through to retail.

That was supposed to be 30,000 orders ~ with only 12,000 wholesaled in Q3, it means Q4 needs to get 18,000 wholesaled. Not impossible but why not linear production? It looks like there's been issues at Nitra, either production line or parts supply, and it's taken until September to resolve?

Dealers have to pay in full for the vehicle before it's shipped from Nitra, so I guess that's when it's counted as wholesaled. It's only counted as retail once it's sold, paid for, and usually registered for the owner by the dealer. So there's a natural time lag between the two.
Post #863865 27th Oct 2020 4:32pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
Latest update:


Click image to enlarge


What's interesting is this now shows the gap between wholesales and retails from what I'm assuming is the beginning of production for retail sale (as opposed to the prototypes, pre-production models, etc).

Global dealer inventory then sits at 7,637. That's 44% of actual global retail sales or 30% of global wholesale sales.
Post #873018 15th Dec 2020 10:18am
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Simon Audi



Member Since: 19 Nov 2020
Location: Newport
Posts: 544

United Kingdom 
Yes - seems a lot of stock - until you concider 6 to 8 weeks from shipping to retail in USA and Asia and Australia.

Then that probably halves that number... but there is for sure lots of stock available.. even the new 3.0L i6 diesels..

Just search Autotrader..
Post #873024 15th Dec 2020 11:03am
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Tim in Scotland



Member Since: 23 May 2007
Location: The Land that time forgot
Posts: 3748

 
Last week when I called into my local dealership there was hardly room to park on their site because of new Defenders and Discovery 5’s, makes me suspect stock piling in case the worst happens on Dec 31st 2300 and there is no trade agreement due to Boris’s pigheadedness....... the dealer is part of Pentland/ John Clark Group with several JLR franchises so possible they are holding group stock as no room at other branches. Pangea Green D250 90 HSE with Air Suspension, Off-road Pack, Towing Pack, Black Contrast roof , rear recovery eyes, Front bash plate, Classic flaps all round, extended wheel arch kit and a few bits from PowerfulUK Expel Clear Gloss PPF to come
2020 D240 1st Edition in Pangea Green with Acorn interior. Now gone - old faithful, no mechanical issues whatsoever ever but the leaks and rattles all over the place won’t be missed!
Post #873025 15th Dec 2020 11:09am
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milesr3



Member Since: 12 Feb 2013
Location: Suffolk
Posts: 873

2016 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Keswick Green
Simon Audi wrote:
.. even the new 3.0L i6 diesels..


Interesting - surprised to see discounted i6 diesels out there already.
Post #873033 15th Dec 2020 12:33pm
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Oldmowgli



Member Since: 31 Oct 2020
Location: Sunny South East Queensland
Posts: 34

Australia 
[quote="Supacat"][quote="Cheshire110"]
Supacat wrote:

Dealers have to pay in full for the vehicle before it's shipped from Nitra, so I guess that's when it's counted as wholesaled. It's only counted as retail once it's sold, paid for, and usually registered for the owner by the dealer. So there's a natural time lag between the two.


I concur....and that wait has been very long for some of us. Ordered mine back in March, and the ship arrived with it 10 days ago, take delivery this week. Dealer tells me that the same ship contained cars ordered a lot earlier than mine too. It has been quite frustrating finding out that US and UK have had vehicles for 6 months and happily modding them whilst most of us Antipodean's have been waiting patiently.....

I expect there will be more sales building in all markets when the new vehicle gets seen and experienced in the flesh - but I agree they will eat into Disco 5 sales before denting other marques. (I am a case in point)

Anyway, I'd advise everyone not to rely upon the numbers presented in accounting reports. In my many years in industry I have found that you simply can't trust accountants to present data clearly and honestly.
JLR (or TATA) may have decided they need to present 2020 in the worst light and get the bad news out of the way so that it will show an upturn in 2021.

Lets hope so. We need JLR and the new Defender to continue.

Oldmowgli Cool
Post #873194 16th Dec 2020 2:54am
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Tim in Scotland



Member Since: 23 May 2007
Location: The Land that time forgot
Posts: 3748

 
I think for the antipodean markets to get their cars sooner there might have to be a huge continental drift to get the physical distance between you and the rest of the world a bit less ............ Laughing

Putting on my containership captain’s hat it took us minimum of 6 weeks Port to Port via Suez, Fremantle, Adelaide and Melbourne to get from Southern European ports to Sydney (often a lot longer when the Aussie wharfies were on strike). From Southern or Northern Europe it takes a week by sea port to port to get to the USA East Coast, 10 days maximum in the winter with bad weather, although last winter I did a 14 day crossing Le Havre to Newark and ended up on a route south of the Azores and still got hammered (and all the cargo got there, none fell off on passage!). It could be less in summer - Le Havre to Newark/ New York at full chat 28 knots we could do it in a couple of hours over 4 days....... but mostly we were scheduled on a 7 day crossing to save fuel and to maintain a weekly sailing schedule with 4 ships on the service. Pangea Green D250 90 HSE with Air Suspension, Off-road Pack, Towing Pack, Black Contrast roof , rear recovery eyes, Front bash plate, Classic flaps all round, extended wheel arch kit and a few bits from PowerfulUK Expel Clear Gloss PPF to come
2020 D240 1st Edition in Pangea Green with Acorn interior. Now gone - old faithful, no mechanical issues whatsoever ever but the leaks and rattles all over the place won’t be missed!
Post #873218 16th Dec 2020 9:41am
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
Oldmowgli wrote:
Anyway, I'd advise everyone not to rely upon the numbers presented in accounting reports. In my many years in industry I have found that you simply can't trust accountants to present data clearly and honestly.
JLR (or TATA) may have decided they need to present 2020 in the worst light and get the bad news out of the way so that it will show an upturn in 2021.

Lets hope so. We need JLR and the new Defender to continue.

Oldmowgli Cool


Do you really mean to hope that JLR are guilty of false accounting? Shocked
Post #873306 16th Dec 2020 5:45pm
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zilch



Member Since: 11 Sep 2019
Location: Whitsundays & Sydney
Posts: 771

Australia 
Quote:
Do you really mean to hope that JLR are guilty of false accounting?
Shocked

no sand bagging to see here, move right along Whistle Laughing yet another pommie bar steward down under

MY20 110 P400 SE Defender
MY10 3.0 RR Sport
Post #873379 16th Dec 2020 10:27pm
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