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Bluest



Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 3993

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black
Transmission Noise - This could be expensive!
I have a noise coming coming from somewhere in the driveline that needs diagnosing. The best way I can describe it is a loud dry bearing noise. When it happens, it sounds bad. It’s not a whine like you might expect from a worn diff (I do have a bit of that). It’s not rumble like a knackered wheel bearing.

It occurs on very light or neutral throttle and is absent under load or overrun. It’s worst on a gentle decent when you just need a tiny amount of throttle to maintain speed. Here’s the awkward bit, it only does it once the car is well warmed up on a long fast run, and only in warm weather. Doesn’t present itself at lower speeds. I just got back from Morocco and it was evident in the warm weather there and in Spain, but gone, or much reduced as we got north and it got cold. Did the same thing on my Pyrenees trip over the summer. The problem is I can’t replicate in the cold weather we have here.

I do know my clutch is knackered as it is rattling like hell, but my feeling is this is not related. I did try changing to a higher quality synthetic gear oil throughout the transmission, in case it was mineral oil not liking the heat, but that’s made no difference.

I really want to get this sorted before next years trips in case it is an axle or gearbox about to expire, but don’t want to to start changing random things in the hope I’ve fixed it, only to find out it still there or even worse when I’m somewhere remote and hot next year. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS
Post #800892 5th Nov 2019 3:25pm
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X4SKP



Member Since: 29 Nov 2013
Location: Berkshire
Posts: 2284

United Kingdom 2010 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SW Stornoway Grey
Hello Bluest

One approach if you can arrange it that may help, even get straight to the issue (or issues)
is to find a good garage (Land Rover independent specialist would be ideal) get the Puma up off
the ground on a lift so you can walk underneath it. The garage should also be able to lift the vehicle
up on axle stands (the slide in type designed to work on the lift) this means that the Land Rover
can be 'driven' rolling road like but in fresh air. If they are good, they will be able to roam around
underneath and locate the area giving trouble... Thumbs Up

One word of caution...they should check...
(you should check if there) that all tyres are stone free before they are spun up... Shocked

I have done this twice once to confirm recently a wheel bearing and previously a universal prop shaft joint.

Good Luck SKIP
https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic83242.html
Post #800904 5th Nov 2019 5:56pm
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Bluest



Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 3993

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black
Thanks X4. That’s probably the best approach, but am concerned that it won’t show up as it doesn’t happen at low temps. Even in the warm the car needs to on the motorway for 20 mins plus before it starts to make noises. I don’t have a trusted specialist either, which is a separate problem. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS
Post #800987 6th Nov 2019 8:15am
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blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 16809

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey
Noises like this can be incredibly hard to track down, at least until something finally breaks.

From the description my immediate suspicion would be that you have a bearing breaking up in the gearbox. Do you notice any additional vibration through the gear lever when the noise is happening?
Post #801002 6th Nov 2019 9:58am
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Bluest



Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 3993

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black
I haven’t noticed any additional vibes. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS
Post #801018 6th Nov 2019 12:21pm
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blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 16809

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey
About this time last year my Disco2 (at 200k+ miles) started making a noise which matches your description almost exactly. Since it was impossible to track it down, I lived with it until earlier this year when, in the course of one journey, it suddenly became very much worse, quite alarming in fact, at which time the gear lever also started vibrating significantly whenever the noise was occurring - vibrating enough to be uncomfortable to hold. This confirmed my diagnosis of a bearing in the gearbox failing, and a replacement gearbox from a breaker has cured the problem.

I haven't yet stripped the old box to find out what has actually failed, but I suspect that the intermediate bearing on the mainshaft is breaking up.
Post #801024 6th Nov 2019 1:34pm
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Will@LRW



Member Since: 04 May 2019
Location: UK
Posts: 124

1997 Defender 110 300 Tdi CSW Alpine White
I've had this type of noise twice, once a failing rear diff input bearing and once a seized UJ. On overrun it sounded like dropping a bag of bolts into a blender Confused

Take one prop off drive it to see if it changes. Only appearing when warm could be due to treacle-like diff oil absorbing the noise. LR Workshop
Find a Defender's history and spec: https://defender.lrworkshop.com
Post #801028 6th Nov 2019 2:05pm
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Bluest



Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 3993

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black
Thanks Will. I will try that, although the need for hot weather for the issue to manifest may limit what I can detect. I may also just change all the UJs as a matter of course as I don't have any record of them being renewed in the past. There's no obvious play in them, but you never know.

Regarding the axles. Is there any way I can check the health of the input bearings, by checking play or end float or anything? 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS
Post #801062 6th Nov 2019 5:13pm
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Will@LRW



Member Since: 04 May 2019
Location: UK
Posts: 124

1997 Defender 110 300 Tdi CSW Alpine White
Basically I put pressure on the diff flange in different directions whilst turning it to feel for roughness, but certainly you don't want there to be any movement of the flange up or down, side to side or in and out. LR Workshop
Find a Defender's history and spec: https://defender.lrworkshop.com
Post #801354 8th Nov 2019 2:57pm
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custom90



Member Since: 21 Jan 2010
Location: South West, England.
Posts: 19452

United Kingdom 
It's worth being sure the diff nose pinion bolt / nut isn't loose too and no movements in the flange as mentioned I think above.
It sounds over simple but as with other things it can often be the smaller cheaper things. (Hopefully!) that are the culprits.
Everything cheaper, and easy access is worth checking before delving deeper.
And Prop UJ's and take they off the check as well, because they can be difficult to find a failed UJ too.

It could be many things and there are plenty of ideas here given, some easy to check others not so butt start with the easiest and work your way though each ite.
Sometimes the smallest thing can seem like a really big problem.

Thumbs Up Diesels Lives Matter. ⛽️🛢️👨‍🔧🧰⚙️
And if You Love the Country, then we’re on the same side ~
I got’ love for Britain, I got’ British pride’. 🇬🇧
Post #801371 8th Nov 2019 5:04pm
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Marks Landy



Member Since: 09 Feb 2015
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 296

United Kingdom 1985 Defender 90 200 Tdi SW Java Black
Maybe a quick squirt with a grease gun on the prop shaft yokes before you start removing prop shafts?
Post #801377 8th Nov 2019 6:00pm
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Bluest



Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 3993

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black
The UJ are all well greased, so I fairly sure it’s not that. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS
Post #801390 8th Nov 2019 7:37pm
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mick



Member Since: 08 Feb 2010
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 2109

England 2010 Defender 130 Puma 2.4 HCPU Rimini Red
Have a ride over to Stonelake of Halifax they are a top team and do loads of Defenders
Post #801394 8th Nov 2019 7:49pm
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110willow



Member Since: 22 Dec 2022
Location: Worcestershire
Posts: 1

United Kingdom 
What was the outcome to this?
Post #975498 22nd Dec 2022 5:46pm
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LR90XS2011



Member Since: 05 Apr 2011
Location: bickenhill
Posts: 3602

United Kingdom 2011 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Galway Green
How old and what make are your tyres I had something like this, replaced the Tyres and it disappeared DEFENDER 90 TDCI XS,

I hope everyone is well and your land rovers make you happy
Post #975529 23rd Dec 2022 6:31am
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