 | Home > Off Topic > Coronavirus Discussion/Advice/Assistance Thread (Part 2) |
 
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| LandRoverAnorak Member Since: 17 Jul 2011 Location: Surrey Posts: 11240   
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In the context of the big picture though, that's just semantics. Whilst I've no doubt that some people with the virus have died from unrelated causes, the overall trend is clearly upwards. Even if that scenario applied to half of all recorded Covid deaths, which is clearly an exaggeration, there are still tens of thousands that have died from it. Add to that that it is both invisible and luck of the draw whether you'll suffer a little or a lot, then it's a significant risk. Darren
110 USW BUILD THREAD - EXPEDITION TRAILER - 200tdi 90 BUILD THREAD - SANKEY TRAILER - IG@landroveranorak "You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought!" - Princess Leia |
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23rd Oct 2020 11:45am |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 
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It wasn't increasing on the 26th March, so you could have said what you are saying now then...some of us worry because of what came immediately after then might be about to happen again... the 2nd wave... |
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23rd Oct 2020 12:00pm |
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| Doc P Member Since: 03 Apr 2016 Location: Midlands Posts: 565 
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Joe's right. There's a large proportion of deaths that test positive at some point during their hospital episode (not necessarily at the start, as patients are screened for coronavirus at regular intervals during their stay - say, weekly) who die from other causes. They die 'with' it rather than 'from' it. The ONS is keen to code all Covid-related deaths and so if it's mentioned on the death certificate it'll go into the data pool and if they test positive it'll almost always go on the death certificate - even if it's only contributory. If you die within 28 days of a positive test, you die with or from Covid-19. A large proportion of our deaths died in the end having survived the initial insult of Covid-19 only to then get a secondary, 'hospital-acquired' infection and succumb to that Some things are potentially due to the coronavirus' unique nastiness too - like the tendency for blood to clot more. Things like strokes, heart-attacks, pulmonary emboli etc.. All of that is 'potentially' a result of Covid-19 in the presence of a positive test (or clinical suspicion with a negative test) but is different from the classical lung-related disease and all of that potentially fatal in its own right. We've unfortunately had deaths due to complications of treatment too - like giving anticoagulant medication to prevent blood clots/strokes etc. which caused a fatal bleed in someone (because nobody knows what dose of such drugs you should give, or indeed whether there's a risk/benefit ration the right way round at all!). Others have died with repeatedly negative tests for Covid-19 but with such 'Covid-like' disease that they were coded as having died from Covid-19 anyway! Don't believe all of the numbers as they can be misleading in other words. The truth is though that there certainly are now increasing numbers of patients needing hospital treatment for Covid-19. That is irrefutable and real, I'm afraid. PS - What's even 'funnier' is that we still have very little to treat it with, only effectively being left with damage-limitation by using a bloody steroid! (after over 70 years of intensive care medicine, the best evidence for anything useful falls down to a steroid  ) and even that's reserved for the sickest, because giving it to the less sick means they will die more often if you do!! |
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23rd Oct 2020 12:11pm |
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| 90 Dreamer Member Since: 13 Jul 2019 Location: Oop North Posts: 2050 
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lies, damn lies and statistics..............
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23rd Oct 2020 12:45pm |
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| Muddybigdog Member Since: 11 Apr 2014 Location: Suffolk Posts: 991 
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Doc P, having been on the front line and amongst the thick of the pandemic, do you think that the tangerine clown running for president had the virus?
BTW MANY still think you and your colleagues are heroes, even though the appreciation seems to have dwindled  Jumped ship to reliability - Mitsubishi L200
Puma 90 XS - Sold D3 - 2.7 S x2 (both Sold) Freelander 2 HSE - Sold Freelander 1 - Sold Disco 2 - Sold |
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23rd Oct 2020 10:19pm |
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| Doc P Member Since: 03 Apr 2016 Location: Midlands Posts: 565
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Yes - he and the First Lady. I suppose one could think it was some sort of publicity stunt but it sounded like Melania wasn’t very well!
Thanks for the comment. I am just doing my job. Many staff were redeployed to ITU and found seeing so much death and, I’m afraid to say, suffering very traumatic. They don’t have the thicker skin you need to work in such an environment and very few of them will want to do it again. Lots of ITU staff don’t want to do it again! The second wave, if it hits, will be harder and more damaging. Let’s pay our nurses what they deserve. |
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24th Oct 2020 8:19am |
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| 90 Dreamer Member Since: 13 Jul 2019 Location: Oop North Posts: 2050
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So another lockdown England wise (Wales already in and Nicola about to announce further measures)
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31st Oct 2020 8:43pm |
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| Rashers Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3335 
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It seems the infection rate is far far worse than even the worst case scenario which the Government and the Health Officials had feared.
I tend to class myself as very lucky. I live in a nice house with a big garden and some fields I can walk round in the country. I cannot imagine what I would be feeling if I lived on the 23rd Floor of a block of flats in Tower Hamlets 
I was chatting to a young Guy I used to work with tonight. He is single and lives in a house with a tiny garden he shares with a workmate. He is an outside kind of a Guy who likes group activities and participating in group sports. He is dreading four weeks of being on his own. I really feel for him and all who are feeling the same as him. Lockdown this time will probably not come with the wall to wall blue sky and sunshine which we witnessed last time so getting out for exercise will be more challenging. It hasn't come as a surprise to me. |
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31st Oct 2020 9:48pm |
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| 90 Dreamer Member Since: 13 Jul 2019 Location: Oop North Posts: 2050
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No real suprise either, just amazed at the level of continuing incompetence even to the point of selected 'leaks' and then fecking around for over 2hours waiting for an official announcement.......
On the flip side the 'world beating' test & trace is finding more positives, not really a suprise What would be interesting to know is what % of tests result in a find?? |
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31st Oct 2020 10:01pm |
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| Pickles Member Since: 26 May 2013 Location: Melbourne Posts: 3752  
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I've made several posts on this thread, & as I'm a long way away from you guys, I've tried to sound as if I'm not telling anyone "how to suck eggs".
So, with that out of the way, I simply cannot understand why Boris has not ordered a stricter lockdown, and is not doing more to combat this virus. From what has happened in Aussie, the only thing that worked for us was a VERY STRICT LOCKDOWN,..not allowed out of the house except for emergency, apart from one hour walk. Not allowed to drive car except for emergency (and if you do drive without a good reason, emergency etc, you'll cop a $5K fine), As I said, allowed to go for a one hour walk, but must wear a mask & maintain 2m distance, all pubs & cafes, restaurants, shopping centers etc ALL CLOSED. Work from home if you can,....lots of people working from home, many city offices deserted,..many will continue to work from home, even after the virus has been beaten! Not allowed to travel out of greater Melbourne area,....if you do, a $5K fine will be your reward. No church services...., Weddings & funerals only 10 people allowed. We in Victoria have been subject to these rules & many others for over 3 months and are now slowly getting back to normal, well "Covert Normal",...distancing, masks, and many other rules still apply,....we will not be able to be normal until there is a vaccine. The secret is "distancing/isolation" etc...keeping your distance from others, & getting tested. Pickles. NB: If any of you guys have any questions at all about what I've said, I'd be happy to try to answer them. |
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31st Oct 2020 11:14pm |
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| seriesonenut Member Since: 19 Nov 2014 Location: Essex Posts: 1205
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Hi Pickles, what has happened to your health service non covid? Here we have not seen a dentist in 6 months, Doctors surgeries are closed and everything has gone on line. My fear is many more will die from non covid illness, we may never know. 2010 XS USW
1957 Series One 88 diesel 1958 Series One 88 4x2 |
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31st Oct 2020 11:34pm |
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| ARC99 Member Since: 19 Feb 2013 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 1831 
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seriesonenut wrote "Here we have not seen a dentist in 6 months, Doctors surgeries are closed and everything has gone on line."
I have the mis pleasure of 4 visits to my dentist since July an several to my GP after a telephone consultations. Dentist are working under strict guidelines and have to wear masks that seal to the face or full hoods which pressurised air these have to be tested to ensure air cannot get in or out around the face, what is a 15 minute appointment for a patient turns into a 45 minute appointment for the dental staff. The Doctors surgery I am registered with operate with consultations by online and telephone with a face to face consultation if it felt appropriate, ten minutes for a patient is 30 minutes of a GP's time as items have to be cleaned after each patient. I get telephone calls from consultants at the local hospital anywhere up to 9.00pm to check on my ailments, to book me in for x-rays, blood tests etc all to be done one after the other on the same day. When one needs something doing he will talk to other consultants to see if they require anything doing all to save me having to make repeated journeys and putting myself and others at risk. We live in difficult times at the moment and if everyone stopped for a moment and thought "are my actions putting others and myself at risk of illness or death" then we may be in a better place right now. Don't make old people mad. We don't like being old in the first place, so it doesn't take much to  us off.
Richard |
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1st Nov 2020 10:33am |
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| seriesonenut Member Since: 19 Nov 2014 Location: Essex Posts: 1205
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Hi. Be assured I am not making any criticism of anyone and we cant expect a near normal service. I am just interested after reading of the more severe lockdown Pickles described in how it has also impacted the wider health services. 2010 XS USW
1957 Series One 88 diesel 1958 Series One 88 4x2 |
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1st Nov 2020 11:01am |
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| Rashers Member Since: 21 Jun 2015 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3335
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I know people who have not managed to see a Dentist in years
Mind you, that is by choice rather than by circumstances. Our Dentist is doing emergency work. They can't do normal appointments due to the length of time it takes to clean down after the procedure. The Nurses at our Doctors are the same. Everything gets wiped and cleaned after each appointment. In normal times, the Nurses were nearly always be ahead with their appointments. They appear to be at the front line as the Doctors are mainly doing telephone appointments and not directly seeing patients unless it is absolutely necessary. I know quite a few people who have been called in to see the Doctor after a telephone appointment as the Doctor wanted an examination which is encouraging. Personally, I love the idea of telephone appointments for those ailments that don't involve having a finger poked up my bum or a stethoscope - or both  But I can see how things may be missed. I never liked the idea of sitting in a waiting area with everyone coughing and hacking all over me. |
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1st Nov 2020 11:58am |
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