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Tim in Scotland



Member Since: 23 May 2007
Location: The Land that time forgot
Posts: 3748

 
L90Andy wrote:
Here's my thoughts; I discovered this forum while searching for clever, well thought through and tasteful mods to the Puma Defenders. Something I then feel I contributed to when I wrote my own Puma 110 thread.
I then swapped my 110 for an older '84 Ninety and at the time wondered if people would be as interested in a thread on that, turns out they weren't as apart from the usual reliable contributors I was mainly talking to myself.
I've since sold that Ninety on, but actually I've got yet another one tucked away in the garage being fettled into shape, however I won't be doing a thread on that this time round because it's an '89 so previous experience says not much interest.
But the main reason I don't contribute much anymore is because of the behaviour and attitude of the 'classic' owners towards the new vehicle. I'm a big fan of all shapes and sizes of Land Rover and won't ever have the opportunity to own most of them, but the sheer variety of models means there's one for everyone and no two are the same. The new Defender continues this and should be welcomed as it's keeping the company and the name going. I'm saying this not just because I've been personally involved in its development but as a LR fan its brilliant to get something back out to the world that inspires a new group of owners. I'm just bored of the whole "Pretender", "Not designed for farmers" BS that seems to derail most threads here now. I used my Puma Defender for robust and practical family transport, carrying various loads from logs to bikes and generally being content that it was the most capable in its class off road if required, again all that applies to the new Defender. I'm very glad the new one isn't able to be a cherry picker or whatever else as it would be compromised for what I want it to be.
So, I'll be driving a new one, hopefully sooner or later, to replace my daily Discovery 5 (which is also a brilliant modern interpretation of LR values) but I'm also glad I've got the '89 classic tucked away in the garage in case I ever feel the need to carry a dead sheep around while having deep conversations about birmabright and rivets.

In terms of forum management, I generally click on the 'New Posts' header on each visit. I guess if I didn't want to get an overview of what's going on and wanted to find out about a specific thing I'd just go directly to that section. Not hard to avoid the bits you don't want to see.
PS, thanks to Martin for his management of all his forums, they are a great resource Thumbs Up


Here, here and well put sir. Pangea Green D250 90 HSE with Air Suspension, Off-road Pack, Towing Pack, Black Contrast roof , rear recovery eyes, Front bash plate, Classic flaps all round, extended wheel arch kit and a few bits from PowerfulUK Expel Clear Gloss PPF to come
2020 D240 1st Edition in Pangea Green with Acorn interior. Now gone - old faithful, no mechanical issues whatsoever ever but the leaks and rattles all over the place won’t be missed!
Post #865259 3rd Nov 2020 5:51pm
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100inch



Member Since: 15 May 2012
Location: Brunswick
Posts: 406

Australia 2010 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 CSW Santorini Black
L90Andy wrote:
Here's my thoughts; I discovered this forum while searching for clever, well thought through and tasteful mods to the Puma Defenders. Something I then feel I contributed to when I wrote my own Puma 110 thread.
I then swapped my 110 for an older '84 Ninety and at the time wondered if people would be as interested in a thread on that, turns out they weren't as apart from the usual reliable contributors I was mainly talking to myself.
I've since sold that Ninety on, but actually I've got yet another one tucked away in the garage being fettled into shape, however I won't be doing a thread on that this time round because it's an '89 so previous experience says not much interest.
But the main reason I don't contribute much anymore is because of the behaviour and attitude of the 'classic' owners towards the new vehicle. I'm a big fan of all shapes and sizes of Land Rover and won't ever have the opportunity to own most of them, but the sheer variety of models means there's one for everyone and no two are the same. The new Defender continues this and should be welcomed as it's keeping the company and the name going. I'm saying this not just because I've been personally involved in its development but as a LR fan its brilliant to get something back out to the world that inspires a new group of owners. I'm just bored of the whole "Pretender", "Not designed for farmers" BS that seems to derail most threads here now. I used my Puma Defender for robust and practical family transport, carrying various loads from logs to bikes and generally being content that it was the most capable in its class off road if required, again all that applies to the new Defender. I'm very glad the new one isn't able to be a cherry picker or whatever else as it would be compromised for what I want it to be.
So, I'll be driving a new one, hopefully sooner or later, to replace my daily Discovery 5 (which is also a brilliant modern interpretation of LR values) but I'm also glad I've got the '89 classic tucked away in the garage in case I ever feel the need to carry a dead sheep around while having deep conversations about birmabright and rivets.

In terms of forum management, I generally click on the 'New Posts' header on each visit. I guess if I didn't want to get an overview of what's going on and wanted to find out about a specific thing I'd just go directly to that section. Not hard to avoid the bits you don't want to see.
PS, thanks to Martin for his management of all his forums, they are a great resource Thumbs Up

Couldn't agree more.
One thing I found when going through some '2020 Defender contributors' history here on the forum was that many didn't contribute anything of relevant and/or significant information that I could apply to my (classic) Defender. One member signed up years ago and only commented (negative) on DC100/2020 Defender topics since..... m
Post #865318 4th Nov 2020 5:26am
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Grouse



Member Since: 16 Apr 2012
Location: on the hill
Posts: 512

And another +1 well said L90Andy, I am on this forum for the original older Land Rovers and Defenders but to be perfectly frank I am sick of the 2020 negativity - and it’s clear that with many it’s mainly driven by new vehicle envy and those who would be unable to afford one.

It’s simple, technology moves on as it is doing now with electric vehicles - it’s time to get over it, things change - there is no alternative options. The old Defender was outdated and had reached the end of the road. The purchasers that mattered i.e. of new vehicles - farmers, fleet owners, utility companies and the original type of Land Rover purchaser had in the majority dropped it in favour of crew cab pickups.

And to be clear - I love the original Land Rover and Defender, I have never owned a car and I have always owned a Land Rover for almost 50 years - since 1973. Nobody is more loyal to the original Land Rover / Defender than me.

We are all Land Rover owners, it’s time to move on, there is a place on this forum for both new and old in the appropriate sections. 2017 Range Rover L405 Vogue SE V8 Diesel #16
Land Rover 110 300 TDI
Post #865328 4th Nov 2020 7:30am
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Slideywindows



Member Since: 09 Sep 2016
Location: North Essex
Posts: 1283

England 
A reasonable discussion and we seem happy to have our different opinions on the Pretender and the forum.

Until this:

"2020 negativity - and it's clear that with many it's mainly driven by new vehicle envy and those who would be unable to afford one."

Oh, really?

And how do you know this?

Do you have access to their Bank accounts?

Is it helpful for forum "bonhomie", to suggest that this is what "mainly" drives peoples' distaste for the vehicle?

Smells like "wealth snobbery".

For the record, I could easily afford one, or more than one - if I was mad enough.

I choose not to buy one because I think it it is hideous, and a betrayal of the Defender badge.

So please, feel free to disagree, but make no assumptions about the financial standing of those who are negative towards the Pretender.


I would suggest sticking to discussing the vehicle, rather than fellow Land Rover enthusiasts.
Post #865405 4th Nov 2020 5:43pm
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blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 16812

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey
Grouse wrote:
... it’s clear that with many it’s mainly driven by new vehicle envy and those who would be unable to afford one. ...

A preposterous, arrogant, and inflammatory statement if ever there was one! Particularly ironic when followed a few lines later by:

Grouse wrote:
...We are all Land Rover owners, it’s time to move on, there is a place on this forum for both new and old in the appropriate sections.


Of course there is room for both both the old and new if only people were less prejudiced and belligerent. However if you want to "move on" it would perhaps be a good idea not make offensive and rather moronic personal criticisms of a whole section of the forum membership whilst advocating doing so.
Post #865413 4th Nov 2020 6:47pm
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Sulisuli



Member Since: 30 Oct 2016
Location: South west
Posts: 4788

United Kingdom 2015 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 HT Corris Grey
And it was all going so well Rolling with laughter Rolling with laughter

Please let’s not fall out or get personal over this, the point of the post was purely to gauge people’s thoughts and comments not for it to antagonise or cause an issue and before Martin has to jump in and and waste his time “asking us to play nicely” can we please keep it on “track” or should that be “off road” and continue to add sensible comments to the thread.

Gently stepping down off my soapbox due to my age Thumbs Up 2015 HT XS 90
2008 SVX 90
2000 XS TD5 90


Last edited by Sulisuli on 4th Nov 2020 8:48pm. Edited 1 time in total
Post #865418 4th Nov 2020 7:10pm
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blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 16812

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey
^^^ Well said! Thumbs Up
Post #865424 4th Nov 2020 7:34pm
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markb110



Member Since: 22 May 2010
Location: Guildford
Posts: 2507

England 2002 Defender 90 Td5 HT Epsom Green


Sure hope no one produces a 5 ltr Defender look a like on a none rusty chassis with independent suspension, rollover protection, only four seats, costs £200k and wont be bought by farmers.......

Guess they wont be welcomed either..... Whistle


Last edited by markb110 on 4th Nov 2020 8:46pm. Edited 1 time in total
Post #865433 4th Nov 2020 8:01pm
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mcma1



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 2839

Doesn’t bother me. I am not anti the 2020, just don’t like the appearance but i do drop in to the section to see how new owners are doing. But it’s a real shame to see the My Defender section slow down. That’s where I got my inspiration from the likes of Ken at the start of my defender journey, it was none stop in there years ago! Maybe some new owners will post in there some day. Andy

2014 Fuji 110 SW LS3
https://www.defender2.net/forum/post751233.html#751233

2014 Corris 110 SW
http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic40056.html


My old Xtech 90 build..
http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic15681.html

LS3 V8 build...
http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic49051.html
Post #865441 4th Nov 2020 8:43pm
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