 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > MT82 breather |
 
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| Gloucesternige Member Since: 17 Jan 2020 Location: In the garage Posts: 114   
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I wonder if there was a design change, just like they changed the detent design, again, not in the manual?? Nige
Check out my You Tube channel https://www.youtube.com/c/Defender90KeswickNigelsLandRoverchannel |
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29th Mar 2020 9:36pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16857 
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Nothing is impossible. The excitement is killing!
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29th Mar 2020 9:42pm |
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| Gloucesternige Member Since: 17 Jan 2020 Location: In the garage Posts: 114
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I assume your best option is to ensure the 'box is in 2nd, fourth or sixth to ensure which ever selector rod it is, the thing is forward? Nige Check out my You Tube channel https://www.youtube.com/c/Defender90KeswickNigelsLandRoverchannel |
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29th Mar 2020 10:06pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16857
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Having spent most of the evening poring over Mustang manuals and Defender parts drawings (none of which show the part in question), I have come to the conclusion that the thing in question is probably a support bracket for the front end of the main selector rail. The Mustang has a travel limit pin or stop pin in roughly the same place, but appears to have a different main selector rail with a machined portion to engage the pin.
The main selector rail is involved in every gear change on the MT82 and moves forward for 2/4/6 and rearward for 1/3/5. Different selector spools engage according to the angular movement of the rail, with the 3/4 selector worked directly off the main rail, and the 1/2 and 5/6 worked via levers and secondary rails (and I have already forgotten how the reverse selector is operated). I guess it may therefore be the case that if you were to engage 2/4/6 the main rail will be in its fully-forward position which may reduce the possibility of the bracket sliding forward off the end of the rail, although you would think that good design would mean that the rail would be supported at the front by the front wall of the gearbox. It would be really interesting to see some photos of the inside of a Defender MT82 box as it is stripped, but I am reluctant to strip my spare box (as it is very low mileage and as far as I know a rather good one) just to find out how it works! There is incidentally an MT82 out of a 2004 Transit on eBay at the moment which appears to have the same fitting for the breather... https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ORIGINAL-Gear-b...2917360531 ... whilst this one for the 2006 to 2013 Transits has the fitting in the same place but it appears to be a plastic push-in thing which presumably therefore doesn't do anything structural inside. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/06-13-Ford-Tran...2733990974 |
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29th Mar 2020 10:43pm |
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| Gloucesternige Member Since: 17 Jan 2020 Location: In the garage Posts: 114
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I have alaso been pondering over the manual and have come to this conclusion.. just my 2p worth mind you..
If you go to page 704 of the manual, and look at image E76405 it is a photo rather than a drawing. At 3 o'clock we can see something there that clearly supports the end of the main selector shaft. Now look at E76450 at the bottom of the page and it looks like this part is an integral part of the casting? Note also there are 4 off needle bearings in it. So... I have come to the conclusion that early 'boxes had a cast aluminium support/bearing housing here and after wear issues due to the aluminium/bearing interface, Ford decided to fit a steel bearing housing support and used the breather bolt to secure it. EDIT:- Maybe Ford added a steel insert into the ali casing, and the bolt is holding that in place? Note also in the images mentioned above, there appears to be a spring in the assembly too?? Nige Check out my You Tube channel https://www.youtube.com/c/Defender90KeswickNigelsLandRoverchannel |
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30th Mar 2020 3:07pm |
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| ashtrans Site Sponsor Member Since: 08 Nov 2008 Location: Harpenden Posts: 254
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 Click image to enlarge this is the inside of the bolt showing what its fitted to, I may be wrong ref refitting it but I wouldn't assume the inner guide wont move at all ! Dave |
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30th Mar 2020 3:37pm |
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| Gloucesternige Member Since: 17 Jan 2020 Location: In the garage Posts: 114
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Thanks so much for posting this Dave.
From looking at the pic you have posted it would appear the spring is keeping the radial position of the shaft in check via the four needle bearings. So, I guess, it could flick round if you were unlucky? Nige Check out my You Tube channel https://www.youtube.com/c/Defender90KeswickNigelsLandRoverchannel |
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30th Mar 2020 3:42pm |
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| ashtrans Site Sponsor Member Since: 08 Nov 2008 Location: Harpenden Posts: 254
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yes the spring tension could cock it a bit but the selector shaft is in this tube so it cant go far, Dave
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30th Mar 2020 3:49pm |
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| Gloucesternige Member Since: 17 Jan 2020 Location: In the garage Posts: 114
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While you're here Dave, can you tell me.. please..
Is it possible to remove the little black detent plugs without damaging them? Can the shafts be pulled out with them left in place so they can be tapped out from the iside? Nige Check out my You Tube channel https://www.youtube.com/c/Defender90KeswickNigelsLandRoverchannel |
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30th Mar 2020 3:52pm |
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| ashtrans Site Sponsor Member Since: 08 Nov 2008 Location: Harpenden Posts: 254
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the front 2 detents have to come out, rear 2 can be punched through later once the rails are out,
we drill the front 2 and use a slide hammer, this scraps them, Dave |
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30th Mar 2020 3:58pm |
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| Gloucesternige Member Since: 17 Jan 2020 Location: In the garage Posts: 114
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Mint, thanks Dave.
What was wrong with a ball, spring and grubscrew..grrrrr!! Nige Check out my You Tube channel https://www.youtube.com/c/Defender90KeswickNigelsLandRoverchannel |
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30th Mar 2020 4:14pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16857
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Dave, many thanks for posting that, it is very interesting. I'm trying to get my bearings on the photo, is that looking forwards into the front casing, with the input shaft showing below, or it it somehow looking backwards into the front casing with the intermediate support plate still in place? I am guessing the latter. It looks as though I was lucky that in nearly 2 years of not having the breather fitted the "thing" stayed put well enough to allow the breather to be screw back in. What a strange (and unsatisfactory) arrangement! I am a little surprised, bearing in mind that these that gearboxes hasve now been in Defenders for over 13 years, that there is so little information about stripping and rebuilding them online. |
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30th Mar 2020 5:33pm |
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| Gloucesternige Member Since: 17 Jan 2020 Location: In the garage Posts: 114
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Hi Blackwolf. I’m gonna answer this for you..
The pic that Dave kindly posted is looking forward inside the main box housing, ie:-, that shaft at the bottom of the pic is the rear end of the input shaft. The two holes to the right of the “thing” are where the two forward detents press in. I am seriously considering a strip and rebuild of my ‘box and putting it on my channel. I have a 2017 5.0 Mustang with pretty much the same box and that could do with an upgrade as the shift is crap at high revs. I’d also like to see if Ford used sintered steel synchros rather than the better but a few pennies more brass ones?? Nige Check out my You Tube channel https://www.youtube.com/c/Defender90KeswickNigelsLandRoverchannel |
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30th Mar 2020 8:34pm |
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| MK Member Since: 28 Aug 2008 Location: Santiago Posts: 2257  
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Puma 110" SW ............................................................. Earth first. Other planets later |
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31st Mar 2020 1:15am |
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