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enfield_dinosaur



Member Since: 14 Jun 2015
Location: Tertius orbis
Posts: 120

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Java Black
Diesel mystery knock on the highway
Hi folks,

strange sounds coming from my engine on the highway lately, would like to ask for your experiences.

Usually, the TDCI is running quite smoothly on the highway. But the moment I step off the accelerator, I can hear my engine getting louder with a pronounced "RRRRR"-sound.

The thing I find particular is that I can trigger the noise by keeping the accelerator in the halfway down position. It only occurs when the pedal is in the middle. Flooring it, the knock returns to the background. Same when I accelerate only a little.

With a noisy car such as a Defender, I may be hearing things. Or maybe not. Do your Land Rovers sound the same? A more pronounced diesel knock when at 50% accelerator?

Thanks for your insights, advice and experiences.


Last edited by enfield_dinosaur on 7th Aug 2015 3:31pm. Edited 1 time in total
Post #437389 13th Jul 2015 9:37am
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landy andy



Member Since: 15 Feb 2009
Location: Ware, Herts
Posts: 5408

2006 Defender 110 Td5 USW Zermatt Silver
Mine also does this, so interested in any replies.

Andy
Post #440596 27th Jul 2015 7:25am
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Schw8te



Member Since: 03 Jun 2012
Location: NRW
Posts: 27

Germany 2013 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 SW Santorini Black
Sure it's the eingine and not the gearbox?

On pumas, a 2" lift (more or less) causes this rattling in the gearbox due to the steeper angle in the drivetrain.

Det locker bleiben
Post #440599 27th Jul 2015 7:52am
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enfield_dinosaur



Member Since: 14 Jun 2015
Location: Tertius orbis
Posts: 120

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Java Black
Hi Andy, sorry to hear this.

Is there a certain speed and/or motor load associated with the knocking in your TDCI? For me, it usually starts at 2000 rpm and 100 km/h (62 mph). When driving up a hill, it occurs earlier.

I hope it's not one of the cylinders - Bow down


PS: Reading the comment on the gearbox - interesting, since it occurs more readily when driving up on an incline (but not only). How could one spot a faulty gearbox? And could it be triggered by a certain position of the accelerator?
Post #440603 27th Jul 2015 8:16am
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RED-DOT



Member Since: 29 Jun 2009
Location: stirling
Posts: 2363

Scotland 
A heat shield cracked? 2008 RS4 gone, 123d M Sport, and a Puma 90 XS..
Post #440612 27th Jul 2015 9:08am
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enfield_dinosaur



Member Since: 14 Jun 2015
Location: Tertius orbis
Posts: 120

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Java Black
Have checked that... I am now afraid it could be an injector, since I found many parallels to this thread: http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic1873.h...p;start=15

Andy, have you seen this?
Post #440615 27th Jul 2015 9:19am
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landy andy



Member Since: 15 Feb 2009
Location: Ware, Herts
Posts: 5408

2006 Defender 110 Td5 USW Zermatt Silver
Mine is pretty much exactly as you say. On a daily basis I don't notice it at all but on long runs at very light throttle, at about 2000rpm I get the diesel knock. Was very very apparent on the 3000 miles I've just done on holiday. Once engine is warm, and noise has occurred, I can get the noise to reappear at will. I also know it is engine based as I've fiddled with most other items. On last years holiday it was much much much worse and became a massive knocking eventually, that was on,y resolved by fitting a new VCV and getting it recalibrated, then map replaced. I'm almost at a point of believing it's a very nasty horrible ford transit engine, and I'm being over sensitive.

Andy
Post #440728 27th Jul 2015 4:27pm
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enfield_dinosaur



Member Since: 14 Jun 2015
Location: Tertius orbis
Posts: 120

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Java Black
Yeah, I'm unsure whether I am too sensitive or not, as well. Still, if I compare it to other Defenders, it does not sound very healthy.

Since my first post I've heard from people with knocks occuring at the same parameters (warm motor, slight throttle, rpms around 2000) ending up with a totaled engine. Reasons were very varied (if they did investigate, which many with a dead engine do not to avoid further costs), which makes the diagnosis hard.

First check will be cleaning the injectors with Liqui Moly 5128. If it helps, I'll know a little more. VCV was also on my list.
Then, there's the next inspection coming up at a very experienced workshop. I will report if I find out a remedy - or if it's just my paranoid mind.

So the best wishes for us knock-afflicted folks -
Post #440960 28th Jul 2015 10:28am
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Caterham



Member Since: 06 Nov 2008
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 6260

England 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Stornoway Grey
dead engine.....are we talking 2.4's or 2.2's here (or both) ?

good luck with resolving.
Post #440963 28th Jul 2015 10:36am
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enfield_dinosaur



Member Since: 14 Jun 2015
Location: Tertius orbis
Posts: 120

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Java Black
Those I heard about were 2.4 litre engines. I know, the 2.2 have their own worries with the oil pump...

Mine is a 2.4, too, MY 2007. 110k miles.

Caterham, in the thread I linked, you reported the same problem with the Defender you sold. Injector changes remedied this, as you wrote. Can you elaborate on this?
Post #440966 28th Jul 2015 10:46am
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Caterham



Member Since: 06 Nov 2008
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 6260

England 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Stornoway Grey
I can't fully recall other than to say the trader who bought it off me took it to TJ Fews and had amongst other things new injectors - seem to recall there was silicone on one of the electrical connectors, and possibly the fuel pump but can't say for sure? - sorry.

I think the 2.4 knocking you are referring to is on start up - something to do with blocked oil ways causing oil starvation to the bottom end and hence ultimately engine failure? I don't think it has anything to do with what you're experiencing?
Post #440983 28th Jul 2015 11:26am
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spudfan



Member Since: 10 Sep 2007
Location: Co Donegal
Posts: 4428

Ireland 
Our 2008 had the knock on start up. It was the Pressure Control Valves not kicking in until the engine had warmed up. This led to excessive engine wear. Had an engine change after six years of ownership with LR picking up the lion's share of the bill. Seems there's an instruction issued to dealers that if a customer reports these symptoms an engine change is in order. I just assumed it was diesel knock and never reported it. It was only when I started getting high oil consumption and increased smoke readings that I knew I had a problem. If I'd reported it within the three year warranty I'd have had got it done free gratis. Still I was treated very well. There are full details given on site here about my troubles and ultimateley getting it sorted.
I can't find the bulletin issued to dealers about this but someone else might. 1982 88" 2.25 diesel
1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali
2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu
2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai
Post #441811 30th Jul 2015 11:57pm
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Caterham



Member Since: 06 Nov 2008
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 6260

England 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Stornoway Grey
spudfan - just to reiterate. this was only on start up?
Post #441830 31st Jul 2015 6:04am
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enfield_dinosaur



Member Since: 14 Jun 2015
Location: Tertius orbis
Posts: 120

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 SW Java Black
spud - wow, still sounds like a lot of grief!

Mine differs in that it's only knocking when warm and upwards of 2.000 rpm/60 mph on the highway. Strangest thing to me is that the knock only occurs when partially accelerating or stepping off the gas.

I suspect that under these circumstances either the airflow or the diesel injection are not quite right. The reasons for it are a mystery, though.

If I want to avoid the knock, I have to either drive like a madman or granny-style. Or accelerate in waves, all not quite practical...
Post #441845 31st Jul 2015 7:10am
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Caterham



Member Since: 06 Nov 2008
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 6260

England 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Stornoway Grey
e_d,

are you saying the diesel knock is there when off the gas?

If I'm not mistaken when in gear at speed and you take your foot off the gas I believe it actually stops fuelling - therefore it can't be diesel knock?


Last edited by Caterham on 31st Jul 2015 11:56am. Edited 1 time in total
Post #441846 31st Jul 2015 7:18am
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