 | Home > INEOS Grenadier > From £48k inc VAT |
 
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| Farmerben Member Since: 16 Jan 2017 Location: Herefordshire Posts: 604   
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Commercial is what you can claim the VAT back on. Don't think any Wranglers can be classed as commercials for tax purposes.
Personally I'd prefer a Grenadier over a pickup for the same reason I have a 2.2 Defender Hard Top over a truck cab - I prefer a van to a pickup. But it's a moot point as I've got a new Defender HT 90 on order so not in the market for either. The launch 2 door Grenadier is going to be LWB (essentially like a 110 hard top) along with a 5 door (like a 110 USW) so considerably bigger than the 2dr Jeep. SWB will follow. Also, again, some people need that 3500kg towing capacity that the Wrangler doesn't offer. https://instagram.com/bentheoandrews |
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29th Sep 2021 2:23pm |
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| LandRoverAnorak Member Since: 17 Jul 2011 Location: Surrey Posts: 11240 
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Ineos aren't offering a 2 door version. It's a 5 door bodyshell with 2 seats, much like the New Defender hardtop and the old Discovery commercial. It has a 1 tonne payload and can tow 3.5 tonnes. I can't see why you'd think it's comparable with a 2 door Wrangler that the base model can only tow 1 tonne and has a payload of around half of that but as you say, each to their own. As for going after the original Defender sector, I think that's true where the 110 and 130 are concerned. However, it was always the 90 that was compared to the Wrangler as they're roughly similar in size, which is perhaps where the confusion lies? Darren 110 USW BUILD THREAD - EXPEDITION TRAILER - 200tdi 90 BUILD THREAD - SANKEY TRAILER - IG@landroveranorak "You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought!" - Princess Leia Last edited by LandRoverAnorak on 29th Sep 2021 9:24pm. Edited 1 time in total |
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29th Sep 2021 3:51pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 
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In the words of Ineos themselves:
"Billed as a ‘no-nonsense 4×4’, Ineos says the Grenadier fills a void in the market left by other car manufacturers." https://cardealermagazine.co.uk/publish/in...4x4/235346 And even clearer still: "Mark Tennant of Ineos Automotive said: “We are filling a position in the market that was abdicated by JLR. They talk about a ‘journey from the jungle to the urban jungle’ with their cars. We are not that; we are the counterpoint with rugged simplicity.” https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2021/...-defender/ Last edited by Supacat on 30th Sep 2021 2:59pm. Edited 1 time in total |
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29th Sep 2021 5:38pm |
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| ChasingOurTrunks Member Since: 19 Aug 2020 Location: Canada Posts: 89 |
I think everyone is correct.
The grenadier absolutely will compete (or try to compete) with commercial offerings. It will also absolutely compete with lifestyle 4x4s. It does the same kinds of things as both categories, but is unique because no other vehicle straddles the categories as well. A possible exception would be things like the F250 with the Tremor package (An HD truck specifically for off road touring) and the Ram Powerwagon, but those come with significant drawbacks for the lifestyle user that the Gren doesn't have. This is how I see it: 
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29th Sep 2021 5:47pm |
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| What puddle? Member Since: 25 Oct 2013 Location: Reading Posts: 952
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Yes, that's how I see it! But I don't think others do. I was in the market for either a Defender, Grenadier, Wrangler, or Bronco (and I don't think I'm alone). The only one I'm left looking at is the Wrangler. Now left.
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29th Sep 2021 6:32pm |
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| What puddle? Member Since: 25 Oct 2013 Location: Reading Posts: 952
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Darren, as far as I'm aware they ARE offering a 2 door version - a 'van' (commercial)... "The Grenadier will be available in a commercial specification – a two-door with effectively a van body, or as a five door, fully upholstered SUV. Pricing will range from about £45,000 for the two-door to about £60,000 for the ‘car’ version." But apparently it's not a SWB, which I thought it was. Farmerben says (above) that the SWB will follow. So I still say that the SWB Grenadier will indeed be aimed at Wrangler buyers, even though, as you say, they offer differing capacities. Now left. Last edited by What puddle? on 29th Sep 2021 6:42pm. Edited 1 time in total |
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29th Sep 2021 6:37pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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No it isn't 
This is what you said:
And why derail a thread all about the recently announced pricing (and some other new things) when you have your very own thread for this separate debate: https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic78547.html
If you are going to use" " to quote a separate source, it would be handy if you then provided a link? |
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29th Sep 2021 6:39pm |
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| What puddle? Member Since: 25 Oct 2013 Location: Reading Posts: 952
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Supacat, I'm certainly not going to get into a argument with you about it!
If you read back through my posts, you'll see that IS how I see it, that's why I said it. My post before this one says that I assumed the 2 door was a SWB (and LandRoverAnorak pointed out it isn't, it's a LWB) and Farmerben said the SWB is yet to come. I DO see the Grenadier aimed at the Wrangler. If that's wrongly, it's still my opinion. I'm not out to derail any thread And neither would I claim any thread as my own! I just contribute to ones that take my eye - I assume Martin allows that. So please control your irascibility, thank you.
The link is: https://www.wheels-alive.co.uk/ineos-grenadier-first-impressions/ Again, I didn't think we were under any requirement to provider sources as this isn't a science site. I won't be adding any more. I don't come onto 4x4 sites to justify my thoughts, simply express them. Now left. |
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29th Sep 2021 7:35pm |
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| ChasingOurTrunks Member Since: 19 Aug 2020 Location: Canada Posts: 89 |
Just a quick point of clarification: What I heard is that they are offering the 5-door wagon and a pickup. The wagon is coming in two configurations: A 5-seat wagon AND a 2-seat commercial variant. I think there is some cross communication here between "Two seater" and "two door". There is 100% going to be a two-seater, but I've seen nothing from Ineos that suggests a two-door model. |
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29th Sep 2021 8:27pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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Just to add to the confusion, the chap in the studio asked about more seats/seats in the back. I thought there was a negative reply but Autocar seemed very clear earlier in the month that a 7 seat variant on the double cab or longer wheelbase chassis was planned:
"As confirmed when Autocar drove the Grenadier for the first time earlier this year, the 4x4 model's family will be expanded with a pick-up truck (seen here) and a seven-seat passenger version, each using a longer (3175mm) wheelbase than the standard car." https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-car...blic-roads The chap who wanted to be tight lipped about future developments said that right around the time he said they would be bringing on future product in the same transparent open source manner they'd been using to date.  Last edited by Supacat on 30th Sep 2021 10:17am. Edited 1 time in total |
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29th Sep 2021 10:26pm |
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| zilch Member Since: 11 Sep 2019 Location: Whitsundays & Sydney Posts: 781 
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If that is RRP, then you have to add another 10% GST and then stamp duty, In NSW it would end up more like RRP $84,500, GST $8450, Stamp duty $3,325 = $96,275 AUD = 51,566 of her majesties finest pounds, that is before vehicle registration costs of course. The usual practice in Australia is to quote RRP minus on road costs and any government levies.. nice marketing ploy to get you excited and then hit you with the real cost once you want to go ahead, all manufacturers do this unless it specifies drive away price which is usually for the cheaper end of town. For non business and station wagon variants they will also get slugged with the luxury car tax, so if you buy the commercial for non business use then GST and Luxury car tax will apply which would add approx another $8210 to the price, so you are now in the $104.5K for the 2 seater commercial Someone has to pay for those new shiny submarines the Aussie government is about to order p.s edited as per COT's comment yet another pommie bar steward down under MY20 110 P400 SE Defender MY10 3.0 RR Sport Last edited by zilch on 30th Sep 2021 7:27am. Edited 5 times in total |
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30th Sep 2021 12:22am |
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| stng110 Member Since: 04 Jun 2021 Location: Melbourne Posts: 102
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Those figures are getting pretty scary. A base Defender is actually less.
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30th Sep 2021 12:38am |
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| zilch Member Since: 11 Sep 2019 Location: Whitsundays & Sydney Posts: 781
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it will be interesting to see the actual pricing regime for the 4/5 seat station wagons, it looks like the UK/Aus pricing when you include GST/VAT are around the same for business use A base P300 drive away in NSW is $85K, so i may have made many assumptions on whether Ineos have or may not have included government levies.. time will tell edit/update, confirmation in a further article that they start from $84.5K plus on roads in Australia, so mid $90' Ks for business and $104K for non business https://www.news.com.au/technology/motorin...bf0ddb3d18 yet another pommie bar steward down under MY20 110 P400 SE Defender MY10 3.0 RR Sport Last edited by zilch on 30th Sep 2021 7:29am. Edited 2 times in total |
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30th Sep 2021 12:44am |
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| ChasingOurTrunks Member Since: 19 Aug 2020 Location: Canada Posts: 89 |
Just a quick point of clarification:
What I heard is that they are offering the 5-door wagon and a pickup. The wagon is coming in two configurations: A 5-seat wagon AND a 2-seat commercial variant. I think there is some cross communication here between "Two seater" and "two door". There is 100% going to be a two-seater, but I've seen nothing from Ineos that suggests a two-door model.[/quote] I am wrong in the above. There is a 2-door version for the Australian market according to Andrew St. Pierre White (4XOverland). Just watched his vid and he has images of the two door doing it’s thing in snow. |
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30th Sep 2021 1:41am |
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