 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > 2.2Tdci MY2015 hesitation |
 
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| skidrov Member Since: 06 Oct 2013 Location: Melbourne Posts: 51   
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Use the extended warranty. You will NOT enjoy changing the EGR valve.
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12th Sep 2019 10:58pm |
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| skidrov Member Since: 06 Oct 2013 Location: Melbourne Posts: 51
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Yes - I did the EGR valve on my car. Similar issue to yours, stuck open. I'll post in some notes I wrote up on another forum (AULRO) but note that my car is a MY10 2.4 - pretty sure there's differences in the EGR valve, don't know how much.
While I hear you re. dealers making cars worse, you need to realise this is NOT a fun job, with a lot of the bolts in very-difficult-to-access spots. At least on the 2.4. Notes on fitting the EGR valve on a 2.4 (things that helped me...): - To remove the electrical connector, you use a small, flat-blade screwdriver inserted in the slot in the top of the connector and gently lever away from the body of the EGR (i.e. pushing the top of the screwdriver towards the EGR) - this releases a clip and the connector easily pulls off (why is every Defender electrical connector different... ) - The bolts are 10mm (the two back horizontal ones) and 8mm (the two that drop down into the pipe to the manifold). - The bottom back 10mm bolt was REALLY difficult - I accessed it from under the car, with a 10mm ratchet ring spanner, both on and off. - You can JUST see both 8mm bolts with a torch, the inner one sighted through the gap between the EGR servo motor and the EGR body. This sighting helped getting the socket onto the bolt. - When reassembling, attach the metal gaskets to the EGR valve with a sealant or adhesive before putting back on the car - you can't locate the gaskets easily once the EGR valve is in place. Then, carefully put the EGR valve back in place - it's a bit of a squish fit through the rubber jungle of hoses... - Once the EGR valve is pretty much in place, drop the back 8mm bolt into its hole before putting the EGR in the final location (ease of access). Then, I suggest putting the back upper 10mm bolt in first to locate the part, and then getting some threads in on the 8mm bolt you put in the back hole. - I put the final 8mm bolt in place by "jamming" it into the socket with a piece of paper and then manoeuvring it in with an extension bar. The above pointers are gleaned from my experience, various forum posts and a Britpart YouTube video on 2.4 EGR valve replacement (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7Z6ArHeuas ) ...also, note that I have since opened and cleaned/freed up my old EGR valve, so it can be done. It took about an hour or so. But, remember the time investment in re-fitting - not small, so if it doesn't clean up OK (and you don't really know til you get it back on) there's the joy of going through the whole awful procedure again... I have not since needed to/tried to refit the cleaned-up part. I actually bought a cheap new EGR valve from AliExpress, and fitted that. There is a quality risk going this way (I also bought a MAP sensor - it was rubbish) - BUT, my thoughts were that my EGR is usually closed (BAS remap) AND the OEM valve eventually jams anyway. So far so good (6 months). Again, my car is a 2.4 so not sure if an AliExpress part is available for the 2.2. So, hope that is all of some help. |
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13th Sep 2019 9:15am |
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| X4CAC Member Since: 30 Apr 2018 Location: Midlands Posts: 212  
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I have a little update on this... I had the EGR valve replaced a few weeks ago and initial impressions were that this had resolved the hiccuping/hesitancy that I was experiencing coming up to 2k revs. The bad news is the change in valve does not appear to have resolved this long term as I'm still getting inconsistent experiences... Unfortunately I can't put my finger on anything as it is so hit and miss... it happens hot and cold, pretty much any gear (although harder to reproduce in higher gear as I'm often cruising at over 2k revs) but not every time I take the car out.
I did get the P0404 error code but I think it might be a bit of a red herring, when we took mine off it didn't look particularly blocked or clogged up. I've left my car this week with Ian @ IRB to see if he can get to the bottom of it, so I'll report back once I get the car back at the end of the week with hopefully some answers which might help others and even more importantly which might save others the cost and faff of replacing the valve  |
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16th Sep 2019 1:36pm |
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| Gladys Member Since: 28 Nov 2015 Location: South Wales Posts: 36  
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Thanks very much for the heads-up, that's worth knowing! Now you mention it, I also find it happens some days and other days it doesn't, but I still haven't had a fault light yet. I'll be very interested to know what answer you get.
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16th Sep 2019 2:22pm |
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| kmac Member Since: 07 Oct 2009 Location: Middlesex Posts: 1294 
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I had intermittent loss of power ( is that what you mean by "hesitant/hiccup"?)
I thought it was the vanes on the turbo sticking but turned out it was the VCV. Replaced with a £30 aftermarket jobbie and it's been fine ever since. |
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16th Sep 2019 3:12pm |
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| Gladys Member Since: 28 Nov 2015 Location: South Wales Posts: 36
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Yes, it's a sudden loss of power which picks back up almost immediately. I think the VCV is the same as the FVV and it looks as though it might be quite easy to get to on a 2.2Tdci. They seem to have changed the LR number, and the newer one is a lot more expensive. Do you recall who you got it from?
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16th Sep 2019 6:13pm |
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| kmac Member Since: 07 Oct 2009 Location: Middlesex Posts: 1294
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Yes I got it on ebay from PF Jones on ebay but they also have a web shop
Link to shop http://www.ebaystores.co.uk/pfjonesmanchester Mine is a 2.4 - VCV is different I believe on a 2.2 - there is long thread on here about how to remove and replace on a 2.4 but that's no help if you have a 2.2. There is a pic of the 2.2 valve on that thread see link below https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic25121...p;start=45 See post from TopQ1967 who has replaced his 2.2 VCV. |
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16th Sep 2019 8:59pm |
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| Vitesse Member Since: 21 Mar 2014 Location: Sussex Posts: 372 
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As part of my investigations into the EGR valve replacement on my 2.2 defender I thought it might be of interest to the forum that some of the Ford 2.2Tdci valves as fitted to the later Transit engines are in fact NOT the same as the unit fitted to the Puma 2.2 Tdci engine. They look almost identical but have different valve valve stroke and gas flow. Even different wiring! The part numbers are the crucial clue.
So, my plan to use a Ford part is under careful scrutiny! just for info in case anyone else is looking at alternative parts. 2015 90 XS Santorini Black |
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17th Sep 2019 1:23pm |
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| 90 Dreamer Member Since: 13 Jul 2019 Location: Oop North Posts: 2050 
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bit thick here but what are you referring to as VCV & FVV ??
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17th Sep 2019 2:06pm |
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| Fat Cog Member Since: 19 Mar 2012 Location: Oxfordshire & Devon Posts: 502
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On my 2.2 from new I've had a bit of a 'flat spot' which could be described as a 'hiccup' (my 2.4's didn't have the hiccup) It seemed to be worse in hot weather and was a bit of an annoyance as opposed to a problem.
I always use Esso (as I have a discount fuel card) so didn't think it was a fuel quality issue but I tried Millers Ecomax every couple of fill-ups and hey presto the 'hiccup' has gone, however, if I fail to drop the Millers in for more than 3 or 4 fill-ups, said 'hiccup' returns. Since 1973...S1, Air Portable's, Defender's, but only my Wolf TUL HS GS remains |
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17th Sep 2019 3:30pm |
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| Gladys Member Since: 28 Nov 2015 Location: South Wales Posts: 36
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Thanks for all the responses so far.
To answer the last but one query, I am no expert, but the VCV appears to be a volume control valve and the FVV a fuel vapour valve. Reading other posts I think it might be the same thing, and it looks from the drawings as though it is part of the gubbins for the fuel injection system. On the 2.2, it appears to sit on the injection pump. There is bound to be somebody on here who can explain it in detail, and whether it might be responsible for the hiccup between 1000 and 2000 rpm. I am a bit reluctant to start swapping out the FVV or the EGR valve if I am not sure, as they don't seem to be cheap or particularly easy to change. Trying Millers Ecomax looks like a good starting place as we have a report of it stopping the issue on a 2.2. From what I can see it doesn't harm the DPF, and they say it can actually reduce particulates. Please keep the suggestions coming! |
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17th Sep 2019 5:17pm |
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| Vitesse Member Since: 21 Mar 2014 Location: Sussex Posts: 372
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Well, i finally replaced the EGR valve on my 2,2 Tdci. 60000 miles and it was jammed shut as my diagnostics had proved. I was warned this is a nasty job and indeed it certainly is!! Took me about 5 hours in total. probably could have done with a few extra tools and bespoke short extensions etc, but got there in the end. Bruised and cut hands as I was also warned.
I did take the old valve apart and it was very jammned. managed to release it eventially but it will never be ableo to be used again. Just a lot of black soot in the mechanism. The motor assebly and potentiometer were fine. So, road test and p0404 code now gone and i can now see correct result on the Ultraguage data as I drive. Will probably re equip with another spare valve as this is bound to occur again. I will get a few special tools for this to help with the poor access. I can provide detailed autopsy of this job if anyone needs it via PM. 2015 90 XS Santorini Black |
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12th Oct 2019 6:16pm |
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| Gladys Member Since: 28 Nov 2015 Location: South Wales Posts: 36
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I have been using Millers Ecomax for a couple of months now, every time I fill up with diesel, and it seems to have stopped the hiccupping.
Thanks to Fat Cog for the suggestion. It looks as though it has saved the effort (and cost) of changing valves for now. |
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18th Nov 2019 11:58am |
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| Fat Cog Member Since: 19 Mar 2012 Location: Oxfordshire & Devon Posts: 502
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Thanks Gladys...glad to be of help! Since 1973...S1, Air Portable's, Defender's, but only my Wolf TUL HS GS remains
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18th Nov 2019 10:24pm |
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