Home > Puma (Tdci) > Alarm sounds when cold cranking |
|
|
WhiskyJackR Member Since: 25 Nov 2014 Location: Lizard Posts: 159 |
Dear all,
RE: MY2013 Defender 90 County Station Wagon Since new I have noticed that if the Landy is left for a couple of days or if it's a cold morning, that when I turn the ignition key, wait for the glow plug light to disappear, and then crank the engine over the alarm sounds for a couple of blasts. I just put up with it as it only happened occasionally. Since I've fitted the Skytag and when this occurs I also get a message from Skytag to say my battery has been disconnected. I am guessing that the current draw on cold cranking is sufficient to trigger the sub alarm and allow the Skytag device to see a voltage drop that it is assuming, momentarily, is the battery being disconnected. Has anyone else had this issue? Any ideas? I checked the battery cables and they are tight including the main earth connection on the gear box. The car always starts first time and cranks over with plenty of gusto. Any farther South and I'll need to trade the Defender in for a Landing Craft |
||
17th Jan 2016 9:31pm |
|
dlks151 Member Since: 30 Jun 2014 Location: Auchinloch Posts: 67 |
I've noticed something similar to this myself. I've had it on 3nr occasions, twice after having been left out through extreme wet conditions, and once when we got down to minus 6, I get a single blast from the alarm and although I also have Skytag fitted I get no notifications.
No issues with it turning over, or cutting out. |
||
17th Jan 2016 10:56pm |
|
WhiskyJackR Member Since: 25 Nov 2014 Location: Lizard Posts: 159 |
Bump.
Thanks for your comments guys, so not an isolated problem. Wondering of any of the technical guru's have a thought on likely cause? Blackwolf, could you comment please. Any farther South and I'll need to trade the Defender in for a Landing Craft |
||
17th Jan 2016 11:57pm |
|
WhiskyJackR Member Since: 25 Nov 2014 Location: Lizard Posts: 159 |
sorry, duplicated! Any farther South and I'll need to trade the Defender in for a Landing Craft
|
||
17th Jan 2016 11:57pm |
|
blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 17305 |
I'd say without doubt that both the alarm and Skytag alert are the result of the battery terminal voltage dropping while cranking. The only immediate solution I can think of would be to fit a larger capacity battery with a greater CCA (cold cranking amperage) rating.
If the vehicle is under warranty I would invite the dealer to do this. It might be worth checking that there is nothing draining the battery unusually whilst the vehicle is standing. It should take several weeks of standing to flatten the battery enough to cause problems. Last edited by blackwolf on 18th Jan 2016 12:10am. Edited 1 time in total |
||
18th Jan 2016 12:06am |
|
WhiskyJackR Member Since: 25 Nov 2014 Location: Lizard Posts: 159 |
Cool, thanks Blackwolf Any farther South and I'll need to trade the Defender in for a Landing Craft
|
||
18th Jan 2016 12:07am |
|
miker Member Since: 13 Sep 2015 Location: Surrey Posts: 1762 |
Second what blackwolf says! I'd also take this as an opportunity to pick up a CTEK charger to leave connected to the vehicle, making sure that the battery is always kept topped off.
|
||
18th Jan 2016 12:42am |
|
Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 |
It might be worth taking this as an early warning sign and doing something about it before it becomes an issue that may leave you stranded somewhere.
You cannot reply on the alternator to top the battery up according to the MY12 Workshop manual: "Do not rely on the generator to restore a discharged battery. For a generator to recharge a battery, it would take in excess of eight hours continuous driving with no additional loads placed on the battery. Trickle charging (defined as voltages <16 volts) may be carried out with the battery connected. Make sure that the battery terminals are fully tightened prior to trickle charging." Out of interest, are the same size batteries fited to 90s as 110s? Mine's a MY13 and has a Varta 90 Ah fitted. Click image to enlarge There's a code - CX23-10655-BA - but nothing that the Varta website recognises. 800 A (EN) should also refer to the Cold Cranking Amps. |
||
18th Jan 2016 12:39pm |
|
McGeordie Member Since: 20 Feb 2012 Location: Central Scotland Posts: 220 |
mine does the same as described by dilks151, I'm sure I read on the forum the issue could be down to one of the door courtesy light switches, I checked the retaining screws and the passenger one wasn't fully tightened, one tightened...no issues. There maybe a more technical/specific solution for individuals, but I have an alarm and skytag, and my car sometimes sits for a week without going anywhere, but this simple solution has worked for me, so worth a check. Sold Def 90 HT 2010...Stornaway..(SOLD in Oct 2014)
Current: delivered October 2014:- 110 USW XS.....Montalcino Red |
||
18th Jan 2016 1:09pm |
|
Orangesofa Member Since: 10 Oct 2014 Location: Somerset Posts: 214 |
Mine started doing this after an extended period of little use. This culminated in the alarm continuing to sound having triggered without provocation back in December. When I went to investigate, the central locking opened but the rest of the electrics would not function. The battery was as flat as a pancake.
After 2 days plugged into the CTEK, the battery was fine and no more alarm sounding on cold cranking. My assumption was that the alarm detects the voltage drop below a prescribed threshold as the starter cranks and so sounds the alarm. Once the battery is back up to full charge, the cranking doesn't cause it to drop below said threshold. Still working fine but I do make more of an effort to drive it regularly to keep the charge up. Phil |
||
18th Jan 2016 2:54pm |
|
dorsetsmith Member Since: 30 Oct 2011 Location: South West Posts: 4554 |
td5 defender 90 and 110, 120Ah 1000CCA as standard ! previous owner fitted 90Ah 840 850 CCA battery trouble staring in cold 90 pick up replacement larger capacity battery fitted my cold starting problems go away with the old battery out of the land rover re charged it to 100% and tested it and fond that it reported AH had dropped form new Does temperature effect how a battery performs? Battery capacity (how many amp-hours it can hold) is reduced as temperature goes down, and increased as temperature goes up. This is why your car battery dies on a cold winter morning, even though it worked fine the previous afternoon. If your batteries spend part of the year shivering in the cold, the reduced capacity has to be taken into account when sizing the system batteries. The standard rating for batteries is at room temperature - 25 degrees C (about 77 F). At approximately -22 degrees F (-27 C), battery AH capacity drops to 50%. At freezing, capacity is reduced by 20%. Capacity is increased at higher temperatures - at 122 degrees F, battery capacity would be about 12% higher. Battery charging voltage also changes with temperature. It will vary from about 2.74 volts per cell (16.4 volts) at -40 C to 2.3 volts per cell (13.8 volts) at 50 C. This is why you should have temperature compensation on your charger or charge control if your batteries are outside and/or subject to wide temperature variations. Some charge controls have temperature compensation built in (such as Morningstar) - this works fine if the controller is subject to the same temperatures as the batteries. However, if your batteries are outside, and the controller is inside, it does not work that well. Adding another complication is that large battery banks make up a large thermal mass. Thermal mass means that because they have so much mass, they will change internal temperature much slower than the surrounding air temperature. A large insulated battery bank may vary as little as 10 degrees over 24 hours internally, even though the air temperature varies from 20 to 70 degrees. For this reason, external (add-on) temperature sensors should be attached to one of the POSITIVE plate terminals, and bundled up a little with some type of insulation on the terminal. The sensor will then read very close to the actual internal battery temperature. Even though battery capacity at high temperatures is higher, battery life is shortened. Battery capacity is reduced by 50% at -22 degrees F - but battery LIFE increases by about 60%. Battery life is reduced at higher temperatures - for every 15 degrees F over 77, battery life is cut in half. This holds true for ANY type of Lead-Acid battery, whether sealed, gelled, AGM, industrial or whatever. This is actually not as bad as it seems, as the battery will tend to average out the good and bad times. One last note on temperatures - in some places that have extremely cold or hot conditions, batteries may be sold locally that are NOT standard electrolyte (acid) strengths. The electrolyte may be stronger (for cold) or weaker (for very hot) climates. In such cases, the specific gravity and the voltages may vary from what we show. |
||
18th Jan 2016 3:07pm |
|
RRUK Site Supporter Member Since: 31 Mar 2010 Location: Leicestershire Posts: 2025 |
From my experience of reading countless threads on the FFRR forum, I would put money on the battery needing replacing.
Once they start to show niggly problems it only gets worse. Count yourself lucky, Range Rover owners come bleating that everything under the sun has gone wrong on the dash and assume the worst. £100 and a new battery battery and unsurprisingly it's all fixed. 2016 D4 HSE 1998 110 TUM HS FFR Hard Top XD WOLF 1982 Series 3 SWB Petrol |
||
18th Jan 2016 4:28pm |
|
WhiskyJackR Member Since: 25 Nov 2014 Location: Lizard Posts: 159 |
Thanks for all the responses.
Seems like the most likely culprit is the battery!!! It has been doing this off and on since it was new so perhaps I just got a duff. It never fails to start and always cranks over at a rate of knots so I thought it might be something other. Perhaps it's time to drop an Optima in? On that note is a single Optima 1500 a straight drop in switch, is the mounting compatible? Cheers ...... Nick Any farther South and I'll need to trade the Defender in for a Landing Craft |
||
18th Jan 2016 8:45pm |
|
Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 |
Well decided to pre-empt any starting issues and stuck the battery on trickle charge using the excellent tow plug adaptor:
It took a good 10 hours to go from amber to green: Click image to enlarge I must find a way to better protect this plug - either replace with a waterproof one or extend the flying lead so I can tuck in in the tub with the charger and extension reel: Click image to enlarge |
||
20th Jan 2016 1:53pm |
|
|
All times are GMT |
< Previous Topic | Next Topic > |
Posting Rules
|
Site Copyright © 2006-2024 Futuranet Ltd & Martin Lewis