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LeonC

Member Since: 17 May 2021
Location: Brabant
Posts: 7

Prop shaft bolts and other questions TD5

Hey all,

So a while ago I posted about a terrible squeaking noise when the car was accelerating or downshifting. So eventually i found that it was due to heavily worn universal joints on the front prop shaft (they were literally oval shaped instead of circular...).

So I decided since i wanted to learn maintaining my own car and tackle the universal joints myself. Tried to unbolt the propshafts without luck, bolts were rusty and impossible to get off. So i decided to cut them off. Replaced the joints which was quite easy. Then i noticed that 1. i didn't have the correct bolts, i guess it is an English size? and 2. I couldn't insert new bolts in to the flange coming from the transfer box. Even after moving the circlip back, i cant fit the bolts in (why is this circlip even there? To prevent the bolts from moving if they ever would come loose I guess?). I noticed there is a large bolt on the flange face, but wasn't brave enough to take it off and hope the flange would come off. So question, how do i get new bolts in the flange? Can I disassemble this flange? Below some picture concerning the flange.

Second question. When I had the propshaft out underneath the car, I decided to take it apart aswell to clean it and regrease it. Well being the unexperienced (lets say completely new) mechanic that I am, I discovered that marking the two parts would be a good idea, but only after it was apart... After searching on google, apparently the propshafts are balanced with a weld on the side? I can see the weld on the side, but now i have no idea what the orientation of the two parts should be, so any advice?

Cheers,
Leon

Click image to enlarge

5th Aug 2021 7:01pm

Retroanaconda

Member Since: 04 Jan 2012
Location: Scotland
Posts: 2547

The bolts should be fitted with the flange removed, however it will be okay to fit them the other way around with the nut behind the flange. Bolts are 3/8” UNF and take a 9/16” spanner.

There is often an alignment arrow on the propshaft which may help you line it up.

5th Aug 2021 8:59pm

rallysteve

Member Since: 10 Feb 2014
Location: Cumbria
Posts: 2197

2002 Defender 110 Td5 DCPU Keswick Green

The yokes on either end of the propshaft need to be aligned so they are both on the same axis so you have a 50:50 chance of getting it back together the same way. I wouldn't worry about the balance though.

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5th Aug 2021 9:54pm

LeonC

Member Since: 17 May 2021
Location: Brabant
Posts: 7

Retroanaconda wrote:
The bolts should be fitted with the flange removed, however it will be okay to fit them the other way around with the nut behind the flange. Bolts are 3/8” UNF and take a 9/16” spanner.

There is often an alignment arrow on the propshaft which may help you line it up.

rallysteve wrote:
The yokes on either end of the propshaft need to be aligned so they are both on the same axis so you have a 50:50 chance of getting it back together the same way. I wouldn't worry about the balance though.

Steve

The yokes on the back propshaft are indeed in the same plane. But are you sure this is also the case for the front propshaft? I saw some videos where the two at the end are out of plane for the front prop shaft. That is also why is started doubting, initially i wanted to install is similar to the back propshaft, so in the same plane.

5th Aug 2021 10:43pm

Retroanaconda

Member Since: 04 Jan 2012
Location: Scotland
Posts: 2547

If they won’t fit then take the circlip off, it’s only there to retain the bolts when loose. Alternatively undo the big nut and withdraw the flange and then you can put the bolts in from that side. If you do go that way you’d be wise to have replacement seals ready in case they need changing. You’ll lose a bit of oil but can top up again easily.

The front propshaft should be out of phase by a specific amount related to the relative angles of the differential and transfer box. Rear props are generally in phase, although on some later models even those are out of phase due to the transmission being at more of an angle in the chassis.

5th Aug 2021 10:53pm

LeonC

Member Since: 17 May 2021
Location: Brabant
Posts: 7

Thanks for the quick reply retro.

Any idea where i can find out what the out of phase angle should be? I checked the workshop manual i have but i didnt mention anything about this.

5th Aug 2021 10:55pm

Dinnu

Member Since: 24 Dec 2019
Location: Lija
Posts: 3201

2012 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 CSW Santorini Black

The front propshaft yokes are indeed out of phase for all models.
On the tdci only, the rear propshaft yokes are also out of phase.

Depends on how much of a hurry you are, I have one out from a TD that I could try to measure or photograph later today so you can replicate. I expect that the Td5 is at the same phase shift.

You will still have a 50/50 change to get it right or wrong though. The Series Landrovers had alignment marks (arrows) on the propshafts, but I guess that Landrover thought that the 90/110 models would not be that serviceable, and omitted the arrows. 1988 90 Hard Top, 19J Diesel Turbo, Shire Blue - Restoration ongoing
2012 90 CSW, 2.2TDCI, Santorini Black

6th Aug 2021 6:42am

Dinnu

Member Since: 24 Dec 2019
Location: Lija
Posts: 3201

Retroanaconda wrote:

There is often an alignment arrow on the propshaft which may help you line it up.

How did I miss the arrows all this time

I know my old Series had them...

Had nothing to measure angles, but I hope pictures help.

Click image to enlarge

Click image to enlarge 1988 90 Hard Top, 19J Diesel Turbo, Shire Blue - Restoration ongoing
2012 90 CSW, 2.2TDCI, Santorini Black

6th Aug 2021 2:42pm

LeonC

Member Since: 17 May 2021
Location: Brabant
Posts: 7

Thanks so much for the picture, will surely be helpfull! I will also check if i can find the arrows, didnt notice them last time but wasnt looking for them.

10th Aug 2021 1:38pm

vaibhav.tlv@gmail.com

Member Since: 28 Feb 2024
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1

[quote="LeonC"]

Retroanaconda wrote:
The bolts should be fitted with the flange removed, however it will be okay to fit them the other way around with the nut behind the flange. Bolts are 3/8” UNF and take a 9/16” spanner.

There is often an alignment arrow on the propshaft which may help you line it up.

But does this fit? The bolthead normally fit inside the circlip, but i think the nuts are a bit bigger and i think they wont fit between flange and circlip? So that would mean cutting the circlip off?

How did you end up fitting the bolts? I have the same problem. I thought about using some low profile nuts and getting bolts in from the other side but not sure if that’ll work either.

28th Feb 2024 2:47am

TexasRover

Member Since: 24 Nov 2022
Location: Paris
Posts: 793

2002 Defender 110 Td5 DCPU Chawton White

I didn't think putting the bolts in the wrong way around would work. I appreciate the OP was in a pickle with very little experience and probably rounded the nuts using the wrong spanner, but removing the flange to fit new, correct bolts is the obvious solution.

Don't underestimate the importance of this connection being correct. I had a td5 Disco once where these nuts misterously worked loose all 4 of them which caught in time as it started clonking in reverse. Would hate to think the damage a shaft like that would cause if it were to come loose.

28th Feb 2024 3:27am

blackwolf

Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 16870

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey

Don't bodge it. Remove the flange and fit new bolts. Anything less is unacceptable.

28th Feb 2024 10:22am

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