 | Home > Td5 > Another Td5 with belt chirp ! |
 
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| geobloke Member Since: 06 Nov 2012 Location: Nottinghamshire Posts: 4395  
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The hunting for idle rpm is also indicative of the flywheel sensors wiring being contaminated by oil and dirt, a faulty sensor, a failing fuel pressure regulator (FPR), a dirty fuel filter a failing or contaminated MAF sensor or that your engine is in need of a good flush and fresh oil.
The "growl" when cold is not necessarily the DMF failing as it could be any one of the bearings in the gearboxes, the release bearing, spigot bushing or even crankshaft bearings. In my case the DMF managed over 200k miles and was only replaced "as I was in there anyway" replacing the clutch and believe me when I say my Defender is no "pavement princess", as my Canadian friends would put it. Ironically that clutch failed 18 months later (it was a valeo twinned with LR HD release bearing, now replaced with a LOF clutch) and the growl was actually the main-shaft support bearings in the R380 gearbox... A growl in the transmission is really difficult to diagnose and the point being is resist the temptation to jump to the DMF being at fault they really do not go wrong as often as the internet makes out. Now belts chirping that is an entirely different kettle of fish and quite frankly it sounds like I am torturing fairies under the bonnet when shutting down the engine... Fan pulley bearing is getting a little worse for wear... #itsatd5life  |
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1st Oct 2019 12:35pm |
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| BaronDefenders Member Since: 28 Jun 2019 Location: London/Cotswolds Posts: 805 
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Interesting what you say about the idle hunting. Whether my symptoms are in fact hunting I’m not 100% sure. The car shudders a bit as the idle settles down and you can hear the turbo whistle matching the vibrations. It probably is the hunting issue to be honest. It might be that the sensor and wiring needs a good clean so I’ll give it a blast with contact cleaner tomorrow. The FPR, MAF, fuel filter, and oil are all new/functioning as they should. So perhaps it’s the crank sensor but whilst it’s working the rest of the time, I’m minded to leave well enough alone.
As for the growl, it’s only when the clutch is held down and it first appeared after descending an incredibly steep and tight road in the Alps last summer. There’s was plenty of clutch action involved  So I’m minded to say that’s possible the release bearing that’s seen better days Charlie
1949 Series 1 80 (SOLD) 2002 Td5 90 (SOLD) 2008 Freelander 2 (SOLD) 1958 Series 2 88 Pastel Green (2019 LR Legends Best Restored) 1983 V8 110 Limestone (Previously owned by Tom Sheppard MBE) 2004 Td5 90 Santorini Black (Td5INSIDE Powered & Rebuilt by CSK) 2012 Puma 110 Zermatt Silver (Overlanding Build) Instagram: @BaronDefenders |
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1st Oct 2019 12:54pm |
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| geobloke Member Since: 06 Nov 2012 Location: Nottinghamshire Posts: 4395
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Ok if the growl is related to your clutch pedal then it is almost certainly the clutch release bearing. If and when you decide to change your clutch I can highly recommend the LOF power spec clutch kit mated to the standard DMF. Works exceptionally well.
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1st Oct 2019 2:15pm |
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| BaronDefenders Member Since: 28 Jun 2019 Location: London/Cotswolds Posts: 805
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I'm planning to put a new LOF clutch and DMF in next year. We've got an LOF clutch in our 2.2 110 and it works beautifully
 Charlie
1949 Series 1 80 (SOLD) 2002 Td5 90 (SOLD) 2008 Freelander 2 (SOLD) 1958 Series 2 88 Pastel Green (2019 LR Legends Best Restored) 1983 V8 110 Limestone (Previously owned by Tom Sheppard MBE) 2004 Td5 90 Santorini Black (Td5INSIDE Powered & Rebuilt by CSK) 2012 Puma 110 Zermatt Silver (Overlanding Build) Instagram: @BaronDefenders |
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1st Oct 2019 2:16pm |
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| Alextd5 Member Since: 11 Feb 2017 Location: Gloucestershire Posts: 322 
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Do you have a video ?
I think mine is dmf, or the release bearing. Normally the spigot which can cause the growl. Crank bearings were on my mind.. but I’m optimistic it’s not!! Only done 80k and always been over serviced. However potentially any part can fail serviced or not.
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1st Oct 2019 7:01pm |
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| BaronDefenders Member Since: 28 Jun 2019 Location: London/Cotswolds Posts: 805
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I can try and get one of the engine at idle tomorrow when I service it. But from memory, it sounds exactly like Paul’s first video that he posted. Charlie
1949 Series 1 80 (SOLD) 2002 Td5 90 (SOLD) 2008 Freelander 2 (SOLD) 1958 Series 2 88 Pastel Green (2019 LR Legends Best Restored) 1983 V8 110 Limestone (Previously owned by Tom Sheppard MBE) 2004 Td5 90 Santorini Black (Td5INSIDE Powered & Rebuilt by CSK) 2012 Puma 110 Zermatt Silver (Overlanding Build) Instagram: @BaronDefenders |
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1st Oct 2019 7:20pm |
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| Paul V. Member Since: 01 Mar 2015 Location: Netherlands Posts: 18  
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Does your 90 have an airconditioning barondefenders ?
Ifso, would you switch it on when you allready hear the knocking sound? When I do this, the knocking sound is gone. So that means, in my opinion, that when you are asking for more power (airco pump on) the ecu gives the injectors a little longer opening time. By the way, we drove more than 1250 miles after changing injector 1 and changing the seales and plates of the other 4 injectors. After those the knocking sound came at idle and coolant warmer than 75 degrees. I will check the cables and crankshaft sensor as Geobloke says. And will test a new sensor. To be continued. |
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1st Oct 2019 8:06pm |
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| BaronDefenders Member Since: 28 Jun 2019 Location: London/Cotswolds Posts: 805
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Paul, no mine doesn’t have aircon.
However, I think I’ve noticed that at full steering lock the noise disappears. I think my next steps will be to replace the engine oil and filters tomorrow and then run some premium fuel, fuel additive, or snake oil through the system. Charlie 1949 Series 1 80 (SOLD) 2002 Td5 90 (SOLD) 2008 Freelander 2 (SOLD) 1958 Series 2 88 Pastel Green (2019 LR Legends Best Restored) 1983 V8 110 Limestone (Previously owned by Tom Sheppard MBE) 2004 Td5 90 Santorini Black (Td5INSIDE Powered & Rebuilt by CSK) 2012 Puma 110 Zermatt Silver (Overlanding Build) Instagram: @BaronDefenders |
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1st Oct 2019 8:15pm |
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| Alextd5 Member Since: 11 Feb 2017 Location: Gloucestershire Posts: 322
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Paul
Is it possible your defender made this noise before the injector failed? Maybe you didn’t take much notice and now since one failed you listen to the engine note more ? Mine has A/C, when I turn on the knock does become less obvious. |
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1st Oct 2019 8:17pm |
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| BaronDefenders Member Since: 28 Jun 2019 Location: London/Cotswolds Posts: 805
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I feel like mine has been making this tap/knock at idle for the last 2.5 years and nearly 30k miles, and thus probably since before I owned it. I’m just more aware of it now having spent a week around 2 other Td5s that sounded different.
If both of yours, Alex and Paul, quieten down with the air con on and mine goes quiet at full lock it would suggest that a slight increase in load is enough to silence the offending item. So, and I’ll happily be corrected, I can’t imagine it being something fatal (fingers crossed) Charlie 1949 Series 1 80 (SOLD) 2002 Td5 90 (SOLD) 2008 Freelander 2 (SOLD) 1958 Series 2 88 Pastel Green (2019 LR Legends Best Restored) 1983 V8 110 Limestone (Previously owned by Tom Sheppard MBE) 2004 Td5 90 Santorini Black (Td5INSIDE Powered & Rebuilt by CSK) 2012 Puma 110 Zermatt Silver (Overlanding Build) Instagram: @BaronDefenders |
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1st Oct 2019 8:25pm |
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| Alextd5 Member Since: 11 Feb 2017 Location: Gloucestershire Posts: 322
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We now have a few defenders making this noise. Like you I believe mine has done it for at least a two years, but I think it’s developed more and concerned me due to this.
But I agree I started listening more to mine after driving other td5’s. I think I will replace my dmf etc, as it becomes far noisier when the pedal is held at a certain point. |
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1st Oct 2019 8:37pm |
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| BaronDefenders Member Since: 28 Jun 2019 Location: London/Cotswolds Posts: 805
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Sadly I can’t tell if mine has stared making more noise as the exhaust is loud enough and I’ve removed the engine cover recently. So the whole thing is just an orchestra of diesel noises!
I’ll have a good listen and mess around tomorrow arvo Charlie 1949 Series 1 80 (SOLD) 2002 Td5 90 (SOLD) 2008 Freelander 2 (SOLD) 1958 Series 2 88 Pastel Green (2019 LR Legends Best Restored) 1983 V8 110 Limestone (Previously owned by Tom Sheppard MBE) 2004 Td5 90 Santorini Black (Td5INSIDE Powered & Rebuilt by CSK) 2012 Puma 110 Zermatt Silver (Overlanding Build) Instagram: @BaronDefenders |
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1st Oct 2019 8:40pm |
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| BaronDefenders Member Since: 28 Jun 2019 Location: London/Cotswolds Posts: 805
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So I’ve serviced the Td5. Before and after the service there was no noise
So either I was imagining it (possibly mine’s just noisy without an engine cover compared to others) or it’s only something that occurs once the engine is up to temperature or on the hotter side of things Charlie
1949 Series 1 80 (SOLD) 2002 Td5 90 (SOLD) 2008 Freelander 2 (SOLD) 1958 Series 2 88 Pastel Green (2019 LR Legends Best Restored) 1983 V8 110 Limestone (Previously owned by Tom Sheppard MBE) 2004 Td5 90 Santorini Black (Td5INSIDE Powered & Rebuilt by CSK) 2012 Puma 110 Zermatt Silver (Overlanding Build) Instagram: @BaronDefenders |
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2nd Oct 2019 6:35pm |
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| geobloke Member Since: 06 Nov 2012 Location: Nottinghamshire Posts: 4395
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Out of interest how are the injector tolerance values at idle both cold and at temperature?
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3rd Oct 2019 10:46am |
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