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Home > Maintenance & Modifications > School me on rear towing/recovery point options - so many!
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LandRoverAnorak



Member Since: 17 Jul 2011
Location: Surrey
Posts: 11240

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 USW Orkney Grey
I'm always puzzled as to why anyone would want to use JATE rings for recovery, particularly on the rear. Regardless of whether they're strong enough, they're in an awful position if the vehicle is bogged down in mud or sand. Far better to use something suitable bolted to the rear cross member, IMHO. Darren

110 USW BUILD THREAD - EXPEDITION TRAILER - 200tdi 90 BUILD THREAD - SANKEY TRAILER - IG@landroveranorak

"You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought!" - Princess Leia
Post #694007 17th Mar 2018 11:18am
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Bluest



Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 3993

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black
In my previous job I was trained to and had to carry out emergency recovery of accident damaged vehicles. We had to use an electronic load cell that would alarm if the force on the tow hitch exceeded a pre determined safe figure ( different depending on the tow vehicle model). That allowed us tow quite large, or badly damaged vehicles using a jaw and pin on a standard tow bar. In even a very straight forward recovery, a ham fisted approach could easily trigger the alarm so you soon become adept at being smooth, and applying loads gently and maintaining a steady tension as far as possible.

The forces involved in trying to snatch recover a heavily bogged vehicle would likely be an order of magnitude higher than the trigger point on our load cells, and could easily damage towing points and vehicle chassis quite severely. I wouldn’t attemp it simply because I don’t actually know where on Defender is strong enough for that kind of load. I’d want someone who had done research, and had the skills to take me through it. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS
Post #694010 17th Mar 2018 11:21am
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Keith5



Member Since: 27 May 2016
Location: Scotland
Posts: 352

United Kingdom 2012 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 USW Santorini Black
leeds wrote:
If people want to get an idea about forces involved in recovery have a read of Billy Vista Recovery Bible here


Now I do not expect people to get the calculator out and remember the various components of the formula every time they attach a winch/recovery strap.

Yes forces can be 3 times vehicle weight so kit and recovery points plus technique need to be up to the job in hand.

If doing a 'snatch' type recovery rather then a steady pull i.e. winch etc, that peak F= Ma (Force = mass x (de)acceleration) so selection of material/equipment is important.


Brendan

Brendan,

It's pretty much that advice which guided me to the product on your store. As it's for occasional use I can't justify the option that agent mulder has gone for (despite how tidy it looks). As it's a standard 110USW with the 3 times vehicle weight was pretty much within the rating of that recovery point, although if I've got the maths wrong I'm happy to be corrected.

Thanks

Keith Keith
Post #694054 17th Mar 2018 2:15pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
Mo Murphy wrote:
That's a really cool pic Very Happy Thumbs Up
Mo


No - it's an OK pic...

this is a really cool pic Laughing


Click image to enlarge


If you have JATE rings fitted then a Chinook is cleared to recover you...don't bother asking if you have nice shiney laser cut & polished bits you bought off a bod on the internet Thumbs Up


Last edited by Supacat on 11th Jan 2021 6:58pm. Edited 2 times in total
Post #694278 18th Mar 2018 10:43am
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agentmulder



Member Since: 16 Apr 2016
Location: Outer Space
Posts: 1324

Kuwait 
I forget what we were talking about.

Jacking points on our Chinooks? Solved the bowel problem, working on the consonants...
Post #694284 18th Mar 2018 10:53am
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Paul1275s



Member Since: 21 Apr 2019
Location: East Sussex
Posts: 80

United Kingdom 2003 Defender 110 Td5 SW Belize Green
Supacat wrote:
Mo Murphy wrote:
That's a really cool pic Very Happy Thumbs Up
Mo


No - it's an OK pic...

this is a really cool pic Laughing


Click image to enlarge


If you have JATE rings fitted then a Chinook is cleared to recover you...don't bother asking if you have nice shiney laser cut & polished bits you bought off a bod on the internet Thumbs Up


Falkland Islands? 2003 Defender 110 TD5 SW
2003 Caterham 7
2006 Mini Cooper GP
Post #814177 8th Feb 2020 12:44pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
It's not my photo so I don't actually know. It does like it could be. Might be worth a bit of Internet sleuthing to see if the original source can be found...
Post #814184 8th Feb 2020 1:56pm
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markb110



Member Since: 22 May 2010
Location: Guildford
Posts: 2506

England 2002 Defender 90 Td5 HT Epsom Green
When marshalling in the past I found in some situations the Jate rings were jammed solid against the chassis rail .

The reason was that the owners did not like the noise of them slapping around so tighten up the bolts.

If you do choose to fit them please make sure that they will move easily before you need them Thumbs Up

Keep your marshal happy, you know it makes sense.

This has been a public service announcement......
Post #814185 8th Feb 2020 1:57pm
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markb110



Member Since: 22 May 2010
Location: Guildford
Posts: 2506

England 2002 Defender 90 Td5 HT Epsom Green

Click image to enlarge


This was my South down tank guard with NATO hitch on my previous Defender....


Post #814187 8th Feb 2020 2:14pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
More JATE ring action:


Click image to enlarge


Click image to enlarge


Click image to enlarge


Click image to enlarge

1 Air Mobility Wing RAF #StayHomeSaveLives (@1AirMobWing) Tweeted:
Our Movements Conversion Unit (MovCU) have been busy today assisting @24SqnRAF with some EROs (Engine Running Offload) in some vital collaborative training. Used to minimise ground time it is essential we practice this at home so it can be achieved when needed. #WeAre1AMW ✈️ 💪 https://t.co/O4tqPg08vY https://twitter.com/1AirMobWing/status/1252642188229586945?s=20
Post #826959 22nd Apr 2020 6:35am
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mikeh501



Member Since: 07 Jan 2013
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 1142

United Kingdom 
agentmulder wrote:
The eventual solution:


Click image to enlarge


Thumbs Up


far and away the best solution for rear recovery imho.

jate rings sound great until you need to crawl under a vehicle in mud and/or water to find them. avoid.
Post #826977 22nd Apr 2020 8:22am
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
If you want to keep everything clean and tidy best stay away from off-roading altogether...you're missing half the fun...


Click image to enlarge
Post #826980 22nd Apr 2020 8:32am
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BogMonster



Member Since: 05 Feb 2008
Location: Stanley
Posts: 389

Falkland Islands 2015 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 USW Corris Grey
Paul1275s wrote:
Supacat wrote:
Mo Murphy wrote:
That's a really cool pic Very Happy Thumbs Up
Mo


No - it's an OK pic...

this is a really cool pic Laughing


Click image to enlarge


If you have JATE rings fitted then a Chinook is cleared to recover you...don't bother asking if you have nice shiney laser cut & polished bits you bought off a bod on the internet Thumbs Up


Falkland Islands?


Yes, some time in the 80s I believe, when they were building Mount Pleasant Airport. No Chinooks here now Sad ---
2006 Defender 110 SW 300Tdi • 2011 Ford Ranger XLT crewcab • 2015 Defender 110 Station Wagon Utility TDCi
Post #827010 22nd Apr 2020 10:47am
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
More JATE rings...

https://www.facebook.com/groups/PostWarMil...167923968/



Think Defence (@thinkdefence) Tweeted:
Which will go out of service first? https://t.co/LN748aFZw5 https://twitter.com/thinkdefence/status/1264604850777657345?s=20
Post #832519 22nd May 2020 5:48am
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
AndrewS wrote:
Please don't use Jate Rings for off road recovery. Have a look to see what fixes a Jate Ring to the vehicle and you will see why they are not suitable.
They are simple lashing points.


And what I hope is a source that can be trusted to know exactly what a JATE ring is:


Click image to enlarge


Click image to enlarge
Post #846789 29th Jul 2020 6:33am
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