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22900013A



Member Since: 23 Dec 2010
Location: Oxfordshire
Posts: 3136

United Kingdom 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 USW Keswick Green
I mean emergency in the sense of yoh would only do it if you don't have the proper strap with loops at both ends. You are right you have to get it fairly tight before tensioning it iirc. 2011 110 USW
1973 Series III 1-Ton
1972 Series III 1-Ton Cherrypicker
1969 IIA 1-Ton
1966 IIA 88"
Post #810546 16th Jan 2020 2:05pm
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blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 16807

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey
I've been watching this thread with interest and some amusement, and I am intrigued by the original post.

Strapping the car in this way will be every bit as secure as doing it the conventional way provided that the wheel spokes aren't sharp enough to damage the straps. There is however a very high likelihood that the straps will damage at least the finish of the wheels and possibly the wheels themselves. It is clearly a development vehicle so I don't suppose the owner is likely to worry, the wheels will end up being scrapped with the car.

So my thoughts are that in the presumed circumstances it is safe, secure and acceptable. If it was the commercial transport of a customer vehicle, then safe, secure, and wholly unacceptable.
Post #810566 16th Jan 2020 4:17pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
Well I'll obviously have to disagree with "every bit as secure", even knowing that the alloys aren't sharp, the right angle returns with no protection will damage both wheels and straps, then there's the fact that the non ratchet end will never tension correctly. Look at any professional load restraint course and that would be used as an exemplar of how not to do it.

I've got no evidence to go, but I would expect a road check by DVSA to pull this and issue advisory/prohibit.

I'm puzzled how you can get to safe, when you have acknowledged the liklihood of damaging the wheels when the are being used as one fixed point of the load restraint and damaging them in the process of securing the load can never be deemed a safe practice.

Your amusement comes from where?
Post #810571 16th Jan 2020 5:19pm
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tookaphotoof



Member Since: 18 Mar 2013
Location: dordrecht
Posts: 1279

Netherlands 2013 Defender 130 Puma 2.2 HCPU Santorini Black
It’s so simple to have dedicated wheelstraps in the car 24/7, especially if you’re testing a car.
Post #810572 16th Jan 2020 5:33pm
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AndrewS



Member Since: 10 Apr 2007
Location: Hereford
Posts: 3706

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 130 Puma 2.2 SW Rimini Red
Perhaps it was just being moved a short distance on private land? 130's have feeling's as well you know Smile
Post #810577 16th Jan 2020 5:45pm
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blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 16807

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey
It won't damage the straps (assuming they're of adequate capacity) and it is entirely possible to tension them correctly. It is unusual practice and I wouldn't say good practice, but the only thing likely to suffer (assuming no sharp edges) is the finish on the wheels, and if the owner chooses to muller them it is entirely down to him or her. If it isn't the owner doing it, I agree it totally changes the assessment.

My amusement stems from your apparent outrage about the approach, which seems extreme.
Post #810580 16th Jan 2020 5:54pm
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jst



Member Since: 14 Jan 2008
Location: Taunton
Posts: 7664

2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 USW Stornoway Grey
i bet it doesnt fall off. Cheers

James
110 XS Utility
130 Puma Station wagon/camper (in the making)
90 Puma Hardtop
Post #810616 16th Jan 2020 9:04pm
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Mash



Member Since: 09 Feb 2015
Location: Guernsey
Posts: 1674

Guernsey 1998 Defender 90 300 Tdi HT Nato Green
Minimum way I’d ever strap a vehicle down, in the case of a defender etc an additional two straps through my jate rings pulled the chassis down and reduced body roll.



Click image to enlarge
 90 wolf - Jasmin http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic39408.html
90 V8 - Maggie http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic42564.html
110 TD5 - Buggsy http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic59029.html
52HG25 lightweight https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic72342.html
D3 Hse - Fiona
Capri 2l S - Anna

Think I might have a problem............
Post #810622 16th Jan 2020 9:24pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
blackwolf wrote:
It won't damage the straps (assuming they're of adequate capacity) and it is entirely possible to tension them correctly.


Capacity is another issue - I'm sure the full round wrap does nothing positive for retained strength.

As to being able to tension them correctly, by which I mean equally to reduce the level of snatching, I was thinking of the Euler-Eytelwein equation*:

This relates to the tension of the two ends of the rope: T2 = T1 eμθ, where T2 is the tension in the rope due to the load it's supporting, T1 is the tension necessary to hold the load without slipping, μ is the coefficient of friction between the rope and the pipe, and θ is the total angle (measured in radians) made by all the windings of the rope (one full winding is 2∏ radians). The tension force increases exponentially with the coefficient of friction and the number of turns around the pipe.

*never heard of this before, although I'm very familiar with the effect - as will anyone who has ever used a a capstan winch.



https://sciencedemonstrations.fas.harvard....round-pole

blackwolf wrote:
My amusement stems from your apparent outrage about the approach, which seems extreme.


That's an awfully big leap from (I assume?) the word "numpty"? I think the truth is I've seen too many posters like this, been involved in near miss reporting, and now it's a "happy habit":

Click image to enlarge
Post #810835 18th Jan 2020 10:12am
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Defender SVX



Member Since: 29 Jan 2009
Location: Co Durham
Posts: 726

United Kingdom 2008 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SVX Soft Top Santorini Black
Obviously no one on here has ever looked at a loaded car transporter Shocked Shocked Shocked

The guys on that job are given 9 minutes to check,load and strap down the cars and many can do it in far less!
It’s recommended they use 2 chocks and 2 wheel straps but most won’t bother.

Personally I’d always lash the 4 wheels but classed as overkill by some.

Agree that the original post could have been fastened to look more professional.

My method hasn’t failed me yet.



Click image to enlarge



Click image to enlarge
 Formerly mao99999
16 Focus RS Nitrous Blue.
11 FFRR TDV8 Vouge SE Black Black.
08 DEFENDER SVX SOFT TOP (SUPERB)
08 DEFENDER 110 DCPU Stornoway grey (Overland Exploration Unit)
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95 DEFENDER 110 CSW 300 TDi Phoenix black
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Post #810843 18th Jan 2020 12:04pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 11018

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green
I take my inspiration from examples like this:


Click image to enlarge


Wink
Post #810933 19th Jan 2020 7:44am
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