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| ian series 1 Member Since: 17 Nov 2014 Location: south Posts: 3127   
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Talking from previous experience, DO NOT get the BritPart drilled and grooved so called "performance" ones!
They are crap!! Mine lasted all of 5 weeks before the front discs warped. I replaced them, thinking it may have been a one off? then the o/s one did exactly the same again 
I know it's BritPart, we all know what the stuff is like! But can't they make anything that actually fits, or lasts longer than a few miles!? Rant over 
EBC fitted, they have been fine! Spend a bit more if you can  80" 80" 86" 88" 90"
Wanted, Forward Control Anything considered. |
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11th Sep 2015 11:12am |
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| rallysteve Member Since: 10 Feb 2014 Location: Cumbria Posts: 2242 
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Why do you need drilled and grooved?
Drilled discs are more or less completely pointless for road vehicles and much less needed for modern brake pad compounds even for competition use. Drilled discs on road cars (which undergo many more thermal loading cycles than a race car) tend to just crack around/between the drillings. Especially on cheap discs. Grooved discs can help increase the braking force marginally and help keep the pad face from glazing but again isn't really needed on a road car. After running grooved (Brembo) discs on a road car I would never bother again. Only real affect was a huge increase in braking noise. Solid discs and good quality (Not EBC) brake pads are perfectly adequate for road cars. Steve 02' 110 TD5 Double Cab Rebuild Thread |
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11th Sep 2015 12:04pm |
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| ian series 1 Member Since: 17 Nov 2014 Location: south Posts: 3127
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I fitted mine as I tow quite a bit, and have suffered brake fade on a few occasions.
Were these not to combat the problem, by keeping the brakes cooler? 80" 80" 86" 88" 90" Wanted, Forward Control Anything considered. |
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11th Sep 2015 12:24pm |
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| need4speed Member Since: 23 Nov 2012 Location: Kilmarnock Posts: 749 |
Mintex are very good. Just to throw that out there...
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11th Sep 2015 12:38pm |
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| rallysteve Member Since: 10 Feb 2014 Location: Cumbria Posts: 2242
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Generally not. The idea of drilled discs is two fold: 1. it keeps the rotating (and unsprung) weight down by virtue of removed material. 2. it provides the pad with a slightly improved dynamic contact area - although this is at the sacrifice of pad life and as a result brake dust. 3. It allows gasses that are produced by the brake pad under heavy braking to escape. If the gas could not escape then it forms a gas cushion between the pad and disc which reduces braking effect. Point 3 is fairly insignificant with modern pad compounds now, and a grooved disc also allows the gas to escape. I think you will find if you look at any real racing formula (e.g. endurance, GT, Porsche cup etc) that when they don't run ceramic brakes, they run grooved or smooth discs. Drilled discs are not only more prone to cracking but also warping. I would say to anyone with a road car (including defenders) that a good brand of smooth disc (e.g. mintex, ebc or brembo) and a good pad compound (e.g. Ferodo DS2500, Carbone Lorraine or mintex m1144) and dot 5.1 brake fluid. All of these pad compounds work well from cold and will be very fade resistant. I have run ds2500s on a 300bhp Volvo whilst towing 2tonnes ish and performance is excellent. There is also minimal brake dust. I currently, and to my own admission/mistake, run EBC pads and I shall never purchase another set in my life! 02' 110 TD5 Double Cab Rebuild Thread Last edited by rallysteve on 11th Sep 2015 5:47pm. Edited 1 time in total |
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11th Sep 2015 1:22pm |
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| MuddyChris300tdi Member Since: 02 Mar 2014 Location: Derby Posts: 224 
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Sorry I should have said dimpled. Well my 130 has got them fitted already and I presume that there is less chance of brake fade with them. I was looking at the middle set on this page or paddocks alternative. Will take any advise on board.
https://ebcbrakesdirect.com/Store/Automoti...rettyPhoto |
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11th Sep 2015 1:27pm |
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| jimbob7 Member Since: 06 Jul 2013 Location: uk Posts: 2055 |
/\/\/\THIS. Pov.spec,ftw. 2006, 110,TD5. |
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11th Sep 2015 2:16pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018 
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Brembo know a thing or two about braking and many of their top spec offers are drilled. OK some of it may be fashion or perceived sportiness but on something like a 911 GT3 (991) you'd expect nothing but the best in terms of form following function:  Click image to enlarge Pagani Zonda:
Lamborghini Gallardo: Click image to enlarge and whilst you may argue that these vehicles have no relevance to a Defender, then maybe this one does (just a bit!): Click image to enlarge Click image to enlarge any issues with drilled discs should be down to poor quality or mismatch to the duty cycle. The latest 911 seems to have some nice trick discs also: Click image to enlarge |
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12th Sep 2015 10:24am |
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| rallysteve Member Since: 10 Feb 2014 Location: Cumbria Posts: 2242
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The Porsche disc and the Pagani discs are carbon ceramic ones so not really a useful comparison.
Just because they are fitted to some expensive vehicles doesnt make them necessarily the best for longevity, or suited to a defender. Something like a Lamborghini lightweight where performance and weight are the main concerns drilled discs probably save a fair chunk of weight. Especially in 340mm diameter. Not questioning what Brembo know, or indeed ap racing... https://www.apracing.com/products/race_car...discs.aspx I very much doubt many Lambo drivers take their cars through water, mud and all season toad spray. Imagine the thermal shock of driving your defender with hot brakes through even reasonably shallow cold water. A better comparison would probably be wrc cars. Almost all of which run grooved discs, even on tarmac events. Feel free to fit drilled disc if you want. They are however a waste of money in my opinion, especially on 4x4s, hot hatchbacks etc. 02' 110 TD5 Double Cab Rebuild Thread |
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12th Sep 2015 2:48pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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My above post was just to challenge your opinion that "Drilled discs are more or less completely pointless for road vehicles" - many manufacturers would appear to disagree, especially for their performance models.
I think I'd argue that a road going Porsche or Lambo has more relevance to a Defender than a full on WRC car, which is a racing prototype by any other name. I'm not sure I'd put weight savings as a major factor for cross drilling, more to do with cooling, gases and water dispersion. You didn't comment on the Merc 6x6 with cross drilled discs? |
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12th Sep 2015 3:27pm |
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| rallysteve Member Since: 10 Feb 2014 Location: Cumbria Posts: 2242
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I don't particularly want to enter into a drawn out argument over this
 . If the OP or anyone else wishes to put drilled rotors on their defender then they are welcome to do it. I can think of better things to spend the money on though. Better brake pads for one!
You will notice however that all of the drilled rotors you have posted images of are '2-piece' construction, i.e. with aluminium centres and cast iron rotors. The primary reason for this construction is weight saving, so I beg to disagree about the drilling / weight saving argument. Drilled rotors on production cars is, in my opinion, 99% about looks/kudos. Along with many of the other 'go-faster' accessories (e.g. carbon fibre wing mirrors, rear diffusers on hatchbacks, etc etc). On the subject of that Mercedes, again a one off 'posing' vehicle. Steve 02' 110 TD5 Double Cab Rebuild Thread |
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12th Sep 2015 4:16pm |
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| MuddyChris300tdi Member Since: 02 Mar 2014 Location: Derby Posts: 224
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Thanks for the comments. Haven driven my mates 560hp
842ft/lb RS6 with uprated Hi Spec brakes, drilled discs really work in the right situation. these being the rears. Click image to enlarge Click image to enlarge But now let's bring it back to the heavy and slow stuff. like I put I'm actually looking at grooved and dimpled discs. Which will be going on my 130 that will up to max weight on a regular basis. It's getting new calipers and want to fit the best discs for it. Going on what has been said plain discs will be fine. |
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12th Sep 2015 5:35pm |
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| Supacat Member Since: 16 Oct 2012 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 11018
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No harm in bring a few facts to the table and discussing the issue from different perspectives.
I think that seems to undermine your point that drilling saves weight? To OP - what grooved and dimpled discs where you initially looking at - got a link? |
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13th Sep 2015 10:44am |
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| Birdy Member Since: 07 Oct 2011 Location: Côte d'Azur Posts: 886  
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The more expensive the discs the more expensive to replace? I get the impression - and it’s ONLY an impression, please feel free to replace it with some facts - that whereas in the “good old days” discs lasted forever (unless, of course, you were stupid enough to let the pads wear down to bare metal), the friction material on the pads being designed to wear away. Asbestos etc. now being a no-no, pads are harder on the discs and it’s not unusual to have to replace discs almost as often as pads.
Like I say, only an impression, but discs seem nowadays to be replaced almost as a service item rather than as a consequence of damage. Replacing standard discs with drilled, grooved or whatever for reasons of bling, perceived raciness (or even necessity?), a different question, of course. Peter |
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13th Sep 2015 12:54pm |
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