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K.M



Member Since: 28 Apr 2016
Location: Salisbury
Posts: 300

United Kingdom 2016 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Montalcino Red
I know, right!

In all seriousness, what’s wrong with her? Is it the market?

I spoke to a few resellers and they acknowledged she’s a beaut, but said that the high end / high quality stuff isn’t shifting whereas the carrots are flying Shocked
Post #1006487 4th Sep 2023 7:00pm
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NickMc



Member Since: 01 Oct 2014
Location: Norn Iron
Posts: 1571

Northern Ireland 2006 Defender 90 Td5 HT Bonatti Grey
Yes the Defender market is certainly on the way down. Think too many people over paid for them and the economy certainly isn’t in the greatest shape either unfortunately.
Post #1006490 4th Sep 2023 7:11pm
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jpboost



Member Since: 13 Apr 2021
Location: Gatwick
Posts: 374

United Kingdom 2014 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 SW Keswick Green
K.M wrote:
I know, right!

In all seriousness, what’s wrong with her? Is it the market?

I spoke to a few resellers and they acknowledged she’s a beaut, but said that the high end / high quality stuff isn’t shifting whereas the carrots are flying Shocked


The top end of the market is always really difficult as a private seller. You get to the point where people want the comfort and facilities provided by dealers. Warranty, credit facilities, reputation etc are all factors.

Of course trading through a reseller is an option, but they want their cut, and if the market is slow, you typically find the resellers may increase their margins to cover their trading costs over fewer sales. It sounds like you've already explored this and not found what you're after.

The dealers and resellers are (generally) happy to sit on stock rather than drop prices, as they are trying to steer the market and keep the value (of their stock) high.

Market economics are what they are, the price ultimately dictates everything. If you haven't been able to sell it at the prices you're after, then you're asking too much (for the car and the circumstances of the sale). We all know we could sell our cars within the hour if they were cheap enough, it's just a case of balancing all that out. I'm not criticising what you believe your car is worth, and it may well be an accurate price for what it would take you to replace it, but that's not the same as the amount of money you can realise from the sale (in any reasonable timeframe).

I recently had to sell a couple of classics, and went through the painful process of selling a car that was easily worth £25k on paper, and would be towards £30k from a dealer. Final selling price was less than £15k. Of course the more specialist the sale, the more volatile prices. Thankfully the Defender market is larger and a fair bit more stable than the market for a Delta Integrale that needed some bodywork...

If you really want to sell. I'd start again, advertise in all the wider locations (rather than just specialist forums etc), price it keenly, and it'll no doubt go. Long timeframe threads where the owner isn't highly motivated to sell, seldom find buyers IME.

This post is genuinely meant to be helpful, and I hope you receive it as such. It is indeed a lovely example and I'm sure it's new owner (whenever that happens) will be very happy with it!
Post #1006533 5th Sep 2023 10:55am
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dainger



Member Since: 08 Feb 2022
Location: Harpenden
Posts: 66

United Kingdom 2015 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Corris Grey
Nicely put by jpboost. I would add that many buying at this price don’t see quality and well loved vehicles, they think all defenders are equal so why would they pay 40k when they can get, a non unsealed, non maintained, ex workhorse which has had a touch up paint job for 35k. (£15k later they realise why they should have gone for the 40k one but that’s too late for you).

Stick with her, but for sure expand your advertising. At the end of the day if you really want rid then collectingcars.com will give you dealer bid price. Sucks but such is life atm.
Post #1006574 5th Sep 2023 5:15pm
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peanutbob



Member Since: 12 Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 279

United Kingdom 
Perhaps give Agrigiveaways a tinkle…they pay decent money for nice Defenders which are then auctioned by raffle tickets.
Post #1006585 5th Sep 2023 6:18pm
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K.M



Member Since: 28 Apr 2016
Location: Salisbury
Posts: 300

United Kingdom 2016 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Montalcino Red
jpboost wrote:
K.M wrote:
I know, right!

In all seriousness, what’s wrong with her? Is it the market?

I spoke to a few resellers and they acknowledged she’s a beaut, but said that the high end / high quality stuff isn’t shifting whereas the carrots are flying Shocked


The top end of the market is always really difficult as a private seller. You get to the point where people want the comfort and facilities provided by dealers. Warranty, credit facilities, reputation etc are all factors.

Of course trading through a reseller is an option, but they want their cut, and if the market is slow, you typically find the resellers may increase their margins to cover their trading costs over fewer sales. It sounds like you've already explored this and not found what you're after.

The dealers and resellers are (generally) happy to sit on stock rather than drop prices, as they are trying to steer the market and keep the value (of their stock) high.

Market economics are what they are, the price ultimately dictates everything. If you haven't been able to sell it at the prices you're after, then you're asking too much (for the car and the circumstances of the sale). We all know we could sell our cars within the hour if they were cheap enough, it's just a case of balancing all that out. I'm not criticising what you believe your car is worth, and it may well be an accurate price for what it would take you to replace it, but that's not the same as the amount of money you can realise from the sale (in any reasonable timeframe).

I recently had to sell a couple of classics, and went through the painful process of selling a car that was easily worth £25k on paper, and would be towards £30k from a dealer. Final selling price was less than £15k. Of course the more specialist the sale, the more volatile prices. Thankfully the Defender market is larger and a fair bit more stable than the market for a Delta Integrale that needed some bodywork...

If you really want to sell. I'd start again, advertise in all the wider locations (rather than just specialist forums etc), price it keenly, and it'll no doubt go. Long timeframe threads where the owner isn't highly motivated to sell, seldom find buyers IME.

This post is genuinely meant to be helpful, and I hope you receive it as such. It is indeed a lovely example and I'm sure it's new owner (whenever that happens) will be very happy with it!


This was absolutely a useful and very well put together post; and was certainly received as such - I'm just sorry I didn't see it originally when you posted it last month!

I agree with everything you're saying - in indeed what 'dainger' went on to add. I think the issue has always been - and you highlight it in your reply above - that it is a very 'one foot in, one foot out' intention to sell and therefore I've always retained an eye on what I feel it is worth, rather than what can I price it at to move her on.

Interestingly I did have an offer from a dealer at £32k but declined. I certainly don't view profit as a dirty word - and actually think it was a half decent offer (all things considered) - but I'd like to think if I dropped the price to £35k, someone would snap her up.

Yesterday I popped her on Facebook Marketplace and I'm considering putting her on eBay in the next few weeks so maybe we'll see what happens with that.
Post #1010916 11th Oct 2023 9:24pm
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DAZ110



Member Since: 06 Dec 2007
Location: East Sussex
Posts: 2003

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Barolo Black
Watch out for all the scammers then. Rolling Eyes
Post #1010952 12th Oct 2023 9:21am
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K.M



Member Since: 28 Apr 2016
Location: Salisbury
Posts: 300

United Kingdom 2016 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Montalcino Red
That’s exactly why I’ve tried to avoid it at all costs. I cannot be bothered with the tyre kickers and the, “would you swap for a 2002 S3 and a quad bike?” type people ha-ha!
Post #1010964 12th Oct 2023 10:04am
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Rivarama



Member Since: 28 Aug 2021
Location: London
Posts: 155

United Kingdom 2009 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Zermatt Silver
dainger wrote:
Nicely put by jpboost. I would add that many buying at this price don’t see quality and well loved vehicles, they think all defenders are equal so why would they pay 40k when they can get, a non unsealed, non maintained, ex workhorse which has had a touch up paint job for 35k. (£15k later they realise why they should have gone for the 40k one but that’s too late for you).

Stick with her, but for sure expand your advertising. At the end of the day if you really want rid then collectingcars.com will give you dealer bid price. Sucks but such is life atm.


To be fair the days of work horses w paint touchups going for 35k are gone. The state of the economy, the cost of financing cars w punitive interest rates and wider ULEZ expansion really hit the market for those toys quite hard.

KM your car is beautiful, but I think that unfortunately that offer from the trader wasn’t terrible. I think yours should go for 35k without too much trouble. I’d get it valeted and post pics on pistonshead/AT etc… it will sell !
Post #1011727 19th Oct 2023 12:09am
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K.M



Member Since: 28 Apr 2016
Location: Salisbury
Posts: 300

United Kingdom 2016 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Montalcino Red
Even good folks!

Right, this has been half-*bottomed* (I'm sure you know what I'm saying) selling Dolly but now she is actually going.

She has been listed on Motorway and I now have an offer which expires at 1030am on Saturday so before she goes off to a dealer to be put on the forecourt for many £ks more, I thought I'd make one last offer on here.

Appreciating the turnaround time is going to be super tight between now and Saturday (I am around tomorrow and Saturday morning) I can update the price to £32,500!
Post #1021706 18th Jan 2024 8:47pm
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Rivarama



Member Since: 28 Aug 2021
Location: London
Posts: 155

United Kingdom 2009 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Zermatt Silver
£32.5k
I am shocked that it has come to this really !
Post #1021713 18th Jan 2024 9:49pm
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K.M



Member Since: 28 Apr 2016
Location: Salisbury
Posts: 300

United Kingdom 2016 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Montalcino Red
Me too! I still believe she's worth more than this but she's now taking up a space on the drive and house restorations need to progress so it's more needs must... Sad
Post #1021716 18th Jan 2024 9:54pm
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Rivarama



Member Since: 28 Aug 2021
Location: London
Posts: 155

United Kingdom 2009 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Zermatt Silver
I have been waiting for the right green one to pop up otherwise I would have bitten your hand off on yours.
Post #1021737 19th Jan 2024 8:03am
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camelman



Member Since: 27 Feb 2013
Location: Peak District
Posts: 3322

United Kingdom 
Its unfortunate not to get what you thought it might reach when first advertising it.

The other way of looking at it is there aren't many other vehicles that you can sell at 8 years old for more than it cost new! 
Post #1021740 19th Jan 2024 9:11am
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Puma_MOG



Member Since: 08 Sep 2017
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 103

United Kingdom 2014 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Aintree Green
Have you thought about Collecting Cars? I have been monitoring Puma sales there for the last six months and you would be shocked at what some go for. A 15 plate 110 XS sold for £44k before fees to the buyer!

Might be worth a shot.

Good luck
Post #1021779 19th Jan 2024 4:26pm
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