↓ Advertise on Defender2 ↓

Home > Puma (Tdci) > Puma Exhaust Mod,...Not worth it?
Post Reply  Down to end
Page 1 of 2 12>
Print this entire topic · 
Pickles



Member Since: 26 May 2013
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 3755
Australia 2013 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 CSW Keswick Green
Puma Exhaust Mod,...Not worth it?
I've often said that modifying an exhaust on a Puma is not really worth the trouble, as the standard system is pretty good, unless of course ya're gonna have a full race engine etc, but for an engine that's just reasonably modified, it ain't necessary to do the exhaust.
I just received my October copy of LRO International, which on page 130 describes the fitting of an exhaust with before & after dyno figures....a gain of .2 of a HP, & 7 ft lbs!!....for a cost of ONE THOUSAND TWO HUNDRED POUNDS!!!
Now I ain't saying the "bum dyno" ain't gonna register substantial gains with a bit of extra rumble etc,....which in reality doesn't mean a thing, when the REAL dyno results are there to see. Of course ya've always got,..ah it feels this, feels that, feel that if frees up the engine etc etc,...but guys the resuls, the REAL results are plain to see, and If I'd spent those funds, for what in reality amounts to a bit of extra noise, I would not be happy.
And bear in mind, this is a modified car, so it should be more amenable to improvement over a standard exhaust,....POINT TWO of a horse power??!!!
Of course, I now am ready to be flamed!!
Pickles.
Post #579532 21st Nov 2016 9:28pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Roy5695



Member Since: 15 Feb 2014
Location: Cornwall
Posts: 1123
United Kingdom 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Indus Silver
I have a straight through from DPF back that cost a mere £150 fitted. Full stainless with a 3" tip. Whistle

Makes a bit more noise than normal but nothing major. Plus its still MOT compliant and i know its as free flowing as it can legally be.

I wasn't too fussed about the power increase. I wanted more grunt, I probably to neither but for £150 it was worth a go, not 10x that amount Idea 2011 Defender DCPU 2.2 - https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic30623.html

Instagram - @r22oyp

Roy
Post #579535 21st Nov 2016 9:37pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
LR90XS2011



Member Since: 05 Apr 2011
Location: bickenhill
Posts: 3616
United Kingdom 2011 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Galway Green
replacing the centre box with a straight through pipe is worth doing just for the weight saving and reduction in cabin heat DEFENDER 90 TDCI XS,

I hope everyone is well and your land rovers make you happy
Post #579538 21st Nov 2016 9:49pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Morepower



Member Since: 08 Jan 2013
Location: Fife, Scotland
Posts: 630
New Zealand 
Some things to note... Although the peak power may only be slightly better... What is the spread like?... Also, What is the comparable time under graph?.. Peak numbers are only part of the story... Although £1200 does seem very expensive... I have Bowler systems on both the 110 and 90 and I think that was the combined cost for both..

Regards

Tim It doesn't matter how bad it is, It can always get worse...

2013 Bowler 110 (Sold)
2016 Bowler 90 Rally Spec (Sold)
Post #579559 21st Nov 2016 10:42pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Pickles



Member Since: 26 May 2013
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 3755
Australia 2013 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 CSW Keswick Green
Standard & modified graphs are pretty much identical,..very minor differences throughout the rev range.
Pickles.
Post #579561 21st Nov 2016 10:48pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Naks



Member Since: 27 Jan 2009
Location: Stellenbosch, ZA
Posts: 2603
South Africa 2010 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SW Alpine White
Remove cat and centre box, that should be a few quids at the local exhaust shop Thumbs Up --
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear
2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged



Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9
Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO
Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ
Post #579610 22nd Nov 2016 8:40am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Morepower



Member Since: 08 Jan 2013
Location: Fife, Scotland
Posts: 630
New Zealand 
Any chance we can see the graphs Pickles?

Cheers

Tim It doesn't matter how bad it is, It can always get worse...

2013 Bowler 110 (Sold)
2016 Bowler 90 Rally Spec (Sold)
Post #579893 23rd Nov 2016 6:52pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Pickles



Member Since: 26 May 2013
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 3755
Australia 2013 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 CSW Keswick Green
Best We can do, but I'm sure someone would be able to copy it from the mag better if you require it.
But you can see the torque & power curves,...virtually identical.
Pickles.

Click image to enlarge
Post #579965 23rd Nov 2016 10:32pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Morepower



Member Since: 08 Jan 2013
Location: Fife, Scotland
Posts: 630
New Zealand 
Hi Pickles... I think you need to look more carefully at that graph... @2100 rpm where the turbo is starting to really get into it's stride the std system makes 96Hp and 104nm of torque... The replacement system makes 110hp and 111nm of torque this gain looks (obviously if the graph is correct) like it's mainly low down so I would expect that the system has less back pressure enabling the turbo to spool earlier. Interestingly its pretty much exactly where you need it as I myself don't rev either of the trucks pass about 3500rpm...and mostly alot lower as theres not much point going past 3000rpm
In real world terms this system would make a really noticeable difference to how the truck drove on the road... It would feel faster to respond to the 'throttle' input and quicker through the gears if you changed up at a more sensible 2500-2600 rpm or just after peak torque, That way the engine would be back in the area where the exhaust is giving the greatest benefit...

In fact, just reading the description (I only looked at the graph Rolling with laughter ) I follows exactly the same conclusion as I have had using the Bowler systems...Both the 110 and the Bowler 90 are in stg 1.5 guise and are really nice to drive on the road.

Regards

Tim It doesn't matter how bad it is, It can always get worse...

2013 Bowler 110 (Sold)
2016 Bowler 90 Rally Spec (Sold)
Post #580023 24th Nov 2016 7:45am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Pickles



Member Since: 26 May 2013
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 3755
Australia 2013 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 CSW Keswick Green
No worrries, I hear what you say,...in that particular rev range, but over the rest of the range?.
However, that is as good as it gets, I believe that over the overall driving range/performance there would be very little in it.
Regards, Pickles.
Post #580045 24th Nov 2016 9:32am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Morepower



Member Since: 08 Jan 2013
Location: Fife, Scotland
Posts: 630
New Zealand 
I think you'll find that you'd need a bigger turbo to have any meaningful gains further up the rev range... However, you would then probably run into crankshaft issues as the engine really isn't meant to rev'd like a petrol..
Trust me, On the road this would feel like a fairly noticeable gain.

Regards

Tim It doesn't matter how bad it is, It can always get worse...

2013 Bowler 110 (Sold)
2016 Bowler 90 Rally Spec (Sold)
Post #580204 24th Nov 2016 9:21pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Manxie



Member Since: 29 Oct 2016
Location: Isle Of Man
Posts: 26
Isle Of Man 2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 HT Keswick Green
Does anyone have the answer to whether or not a certain amount of back pressure is advantageous? For example I've been told that you shouldn't remove the cat and center muffler due to "overspool", and that you should only remove one or the other....
Post #580402 25th Nov 2016 2:19pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Morepower



Member Since: 08 Jan 2013
Location: Fife, Scotland
Posts: 630
New Zealand 
Turbo dependant mainly.... some turbo's are designed to have an amount of back pressure, if this is removed then the seals can fail..

Regards

Tim It doesn't matter how bad it is, It can always get worse...

2013 Bowler 110 (Sold)
2016 Bowler 90 Rally Spec (Sold)
Post #580446 25th Nov 2016 6:04pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Manxie



Member Since: 29 Oct 2016
Location: Isle Of Man
Posts: 26
Isle Of Man 2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 HT Keswick Green
Does anyone know if this applies to the Puma engine?
Post #580480 25th Nov 2016 8:21pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Sadi



Member Since: 23 Jul 2015
Location: Windhoek
Posts: 334
Namibia 2016 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 Heritage Edition SW Grasmere Green
Back pressure...
Some interesting reading here:

http://www.myturbodiesel.com/wiki/turbocha...rbo-faq-2/
Post #580520 25th Nov 2016 10:28pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Post Reply  Back to top
Page 1 of 2 12>
All times are GMT + 1 Hour

Jump to  
<  Previous Topic | Next Topic >
Posting Rules
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



Site Copyright © 2006-2024 Futuranet Ltd & Martin Lewis
DEFENDER2.NET RSS Feed - All Forums