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nickburt

Member Since: 26 Apr 2018
Location: Wallasey
Posts: 26

TD5 Defender not starting

Working on a Defender TD5 that turns over, but won't start without some help with a squirt of ezistart.
Was running one day, then next morning refused to start - no symptoms of power loss or anything noticeably unusual.

Tried:
3 starter motors - all known to be good - came off running engines.
2 injector looms - both good - came off running engines
2 crank sensors - both good, as above, came off running engines
4 fuel pumps - all off running vehicles.
Jump leads to bypass stater lead, plus earth direct to battery.
New fuel filter, changed and bled, pump runs fine and pumps up pressure OK - haven't checked the actual pressure, but as the pumps tried came of known running engines, no reason to suspect low pressure from any f them.
Injector washers and seals etc... changed for new.

Battery drops to 10.8 volts when cranking and will hold at 10.8v for 30 odd seconds of cranking. Cranking speed is around 240 -260 rpm. (Snap On Solas plugged in while cranking).
Also tried with a boost pack connected, so keeping voltage up at 12+v.

Read somewhere that the engine needs to be turning at 300 rpm (can't remember where now!!!), before it'll trigger the injectors.

Give it a small squirt of ezistart and it'll be enough to get the cranking revs up and it will then fire and run fine. It's as if the ezistart is helping get the starting revs up over 300, so it'll trigger the injectors.

Once it's running, it runs and drives fine, no power loss, no excessive smoke etc... etc...

Tried it with the clutch pedal dipped - in case the clutch is dragging the revs down - no different.
Tried it with the auxiliary belt off, in case power steering pump or one of the idlers was slowing it down - no different.

When trying to start this one stood next to another, it's noticeably slower than the other during cranking to start.

Got two of us baffled

- any ideas please. 1986, 127, ex Fire Tender and Ambulance

18th May 2018 8:19pm

ickle

Member Since: 22 Jul 2010
Location: South Vendee
Posts: 1728

2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 CSW Alpine White

one of the ancillaries seized? Alternator, air con etc slowing the cranking down - drop the belt off and try to start?

Good luck

Keith

18th May 2018 8:28pm

nickburt

Member Since: 26 Apr 2018
Location: Wallasey
Posts: 26

Yup, tried that.

nickburt wrote:
....................
Tried it with the auxiliary belt off, in case power steering pump or one of the idlers was slowing it down - no different.
....................

1986, 127, ex Fire Tender and Ambulance

18th May 2018 8:32pm

ickle

Member Since: 22 Jul 2010
Location: South Vendee
Posts: 1728

sorry, have now put glasses on and re read!

18th May 2018 8:36pm

nickburt

Member Since: 26 Apr 2018
Location: Wallasey
Posts: 26

1986, 127, ex Fire Tender and Ambulance

18th May 2018 8:46pm

ickle

Member Since: 22 Jul 2010
Location: South Vendee
Posts: 1728

You've obviously tried another battery, used booster cables and swapped starters so that side of things should be OK
Never played with a TD5 but there's no way the starter ring gear can be damaged / misaligned and causing mechanical resistance is there?

Otherwise a partially blocked / restricted exhaust might be enough to slow it down turning over

Hopefully someone with better knowledge than me will be along in a bit...

18th May 2018 9:03pm

nickburt

Member Since: 26 Apr 2018
Location: Wallasey
Posts: 26

Didn't try another battery, but the voltage readings are good and by using a booster have eliminated the battery.
Didn't think about exhaust, but I don't think that's an issue.
doesn't make any strange noises while turning over, some making the assumption ring gear etc.. is OK, and having tried 4 starters, all sounding similar, think that side of things is OK. 1986, 127, ex Fire Tender and Ambulance

18th May 2018 9:18pm

BCdefender

Member Since: 26 Oct 2015
Location: Nanaimo
Posts: 211

I'm having the same problem. Did you ever figure this out? 1999 Defender 110
2003 P38
2007 RR SC

"And that's why it needs to be celebrated, because when the Defender goes we'll have lost this pointer to where we came from, and we're really going to miss it."

My build thread: http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic47750.html

12th Jun 2018 8:08pm

nickburt

Member Since: 26 Apr 2018
Location: Wallasey
Posts: 26

Nope.

We've also tried all new starter and earth leads, additional earth from starter bolt to battery neg terminal, so eliminated all the possible volt drops in the wiring to the starter.

Will not get up to 300 rpm, so the injectors aren't being energised. Best we've seen is 280 rpm.

Parked up for now - wondering what to do next ... 1986, 127, ex Fire Tender and Ambulance

12th Jun 2018 8:15pm

kweese

Member Since: 28 Apr 2015
Location: Van
Posts: 62

I had the same problems. Changed injector rings and seals, injector loom, crank sensor, fuel filter inlets.. still nothing worked. I decided to bring the starter to rebuild.. .. and of course it was that. Now it starts in half a second.

20th Jun 2018 7:56am

pj2106

Member Since: 20 Dec 2012
Location: Huntingdon AKA The Shire
Posts: 1500

2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 USW Stornoway Grey

I know a simple thing have you tried blowing fuel lines out and fresh diesel?

Also check fuel filter head isn’t cracked 2008 110 2.4 XS Utility (Hagrid)
2002 90 TD5 Hardtop (Sully) Sold
1998 300TDi D1 (Billy) Sold

20th Jun 2018 6:58pm

nickburt

Member Since: 26 Apr 2018
Location: Wallasey
Posts: 26

The problem is that it doesn't get to 300 rpm before operating the injectors.

I'm convinced it's a starter or starter wiring/earth problem. Having tried 3 known good starters, I'm now certain it's wiring related - volt drop etc... 1986, 127, ex Fire Tender and Ambulance

20th Jun 2018 11:11pm

grafty99

Member Since: 15 Aug 2012
Location: North Devon
Posts: 4784

Have you tried a new positive feed from battery to starter? It could have broken down and causing high resistance and slow turn over?

I see you've tried jump leads but they don't give a fantastic connection compared to a properly crimped and terminated cable

2002 90 Td5 Station Wagon
1990 Vogue SE
Triumph Tiger Explorer 1200
Td5 90 Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic50767.html
Tdi 110 Thread https://www.defender2.net/forum/topic69562.html
RRC Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic54492.html
Instagram http://www.instagram.com/george_grafton

20th Jun 2018 11:50pm

pj2106

Member Since: 20 Dec 2012
Location: Huntingdon AKA The Shire
Posts: 1500

Stick24v across it see if that helps 2008 110 2.4 XS Utility (Hagrid)
2002 90 TD5 Hardtop (Sully) Sold
1998 300TDi D1 (Billy) Sold

21st Jun 2018 12:31am

nickburt

Member Since: 26 Apr 2018
Location: Wallasey
Posts: 26

grafty99 wrote:
Have you tried a new positive feed from battery to starter? It could have broken down and causing high resistance and slow turn over?

I see you've tried jump leads but they don't give a fantastic connection compared to a properly crimped and terminated cable

No, must admit, not made up new leads yet - but have tried other leads. 1986, 127, ex Fire Tender and Ambulance

21st Jun 2018 12:43am

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