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discomog



Member Since: 09 May 2015
Location: Notts/Lincs Border
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United Kingdom 2015 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Santorini Black
Designing an Icon

The March issue of "Car" magazine has an article about the new Jeep Wrangler and new MB G Wagen. It is interesting to note that they quote both chief designers of the respective vehicles. Joyce who heads up Wrangler design at Jeep says he was given an open chequebook to develop the new Wrangler whilst Oliver Metzger at Mercedes says it was a costly and intense exercise developing the new G Wagen.

The most relevant comments, when thinking about the Defender replacement came from Car Magazine when it states, "It's all about creating a 4x4 that looks like the original but goes further and harder off road, meets contemporary legislation and packs the tech appeal to new customers and the character to satisfy the old guard".

I think that quote sums up what most Defender owners want to see from Land Rover. Time will tell.[/b] Santorini 90XS SW
Discovery Sport
Morgan Plus 8

Post #685715 11th Feb 2018 9:57am
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
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United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green

I'd like to think you are right but given that JLR have stated they want 100k sales per annum, which is up from their original 50k, then keeping the old guard of @ 10k satisfied must be well down their list of priorities


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Post #685734 11th Feb 2018 11:30am
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discomog



Member Since: 09 May 2015
Location: Notts/Lincs Border
Posts: 1083

United Kingdom 2015 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Santorini Black

That's an interested graph Supacat, not seen that before. It certainly looks like an uphill struggle for JLR to achieve their sales target. Santorini 90XS SW
Discovery Sport
Morgan Plus 8

Post #685750 11th Feb 2018 12:22pm
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Bluest



Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
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United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black

I don’t think they’ll have much trouble achieving their targets with a new model. Old defender didn’t achieve it because it wasn’t a modern car. Even if the demand had been there I don’t think they could have built them fast enough anyway. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS

Post #685751 11th Feb 2018 12:29pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
Location: West Yorkshire
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United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green

and to complete the sales figures for the final years...



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Post #687759 20th Feb 2018 9:13am
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Ramajama



Member Since: 28 Jul 2016
Location: Heartland, ‘Murica
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United States 

Bluest wrote:
I don’t think they’ll have much trouble achieving their targets with a new model. Old defender didn’t achieve it because it wasn’t a modern car. Even if the demand had been there I don’t think they could have built them fast enough anyway.


If they build a Defender that will rival a Wrangler, the US will eat it up. Heck, whatever they come up with, selling it in the US Will ensure they meet their goals.

Post #687952 21st Feb 2018 5:50am
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Bluest



Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
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United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black

Supacat wrote:
and to complete the sales figures for the final years...



Click image to enlarge


The biggest surprise to me there is that the Range Rover outsold the Disco, although I suppose Discovery was near the end of its life at that point. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS

Post #687956 21st Feb 2018 7:27am
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Ramajama



Member Since: 28 Jul 2016
Location: Heartland, ‘Murica
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The thing I find most interesting and very amusing, is the two models that people love to bash the most, sold the most. The two models that purists love the most, sold the least. If you think JLR doesnt know what they are doing and are moving in the wrong direction, think again. The name of the game is sales. As long as they are giving more people what they want, then more power to them.
I will always drool over the old Defender Bow down but Im looking very forward to the new Defender.

Post #688050 21st Feb 2018 5:19pm
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AndrewS



Member Since: 10 Apr 2007
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United Kingdom 2013 Defender 130 Puma 2.2 SW Rimini Red

^ well said Thumbs Up 130's have feeling's as well you know Smile

Post #688120 21st Feb 2018 9:51pm
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
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United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green

Ramajama wrote:
If you think JLR doesnt know what they are doing and are moving in the wrong direction, think again. The name of the game is sales. As long as they are giving more people what they want, then more power to them.


Really?

Not sure how meeting the needs of the masses helps meet the needs of a niche part of the market that defender owners represent. Moving to a plug, play & throw away commercial model will alienate many original owners; who are entitled to think they are moving in the wrong direction. Dilute the real brand values and see where your customer base is, when all the Evoque owners have moved on to the next trend.

Post #688186 22nd Feb 2018 11:21am
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v8bobber



Member Since: 26 Aug 2012
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United Kingdom 2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Java Black

I can see what you’re saying but the masses have the money - if you know what I mean, they’re not going to make a model that only appeals to a limited number of people.

I do worry that JLR have lost track a bit of what they are doing, or at least don’t have as good an idea as they think they do about what people want. I might be wide of the mark but I don’t think the disco5 or the Velar are doing as well they could be. We certainly don’t see that many in this neck of the woods. Could be wrong.

I think that LR have previously sold products on the basis that they are “related” to the Defender, it heritage, and it’s ability, and now production has ceased this credibiltly is ebbing away. They need a model like the old Defender but something that sells.

I’d love to know how they’re going to do that, and indeed IF they’re going to do that, but I can’t help thinking that they could do worse than make a vehicle which appeals to a broad spectrum of people, and can be specced all the way from a base model up to something that has all the bells and whistles.

I just hope to get it looks completely different to the RR, RRS, Disoo etc, but that’s just a personal opinion

Post #688336 23rd Feb 2018 12:28am
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Tdi4



Member Since: 24 Oct 2014
Location: Houten
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Netherlands 2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 CSW Stornoway Grey

I'am afraid that the beancounters at JLR are right. The new models appeal too a larger customer base ergo more sales.

But.... Although at first I liked the new slick look of the Evoque and the Range Rover but all the new models look too much alike. JLR has become a "normal" car manufacturer I suppose. Or to put in another way they have lost their unique line up of cars which I liked very much.

I guess the Defender is a complete different story. Because they haven't invested in modernising the car along the way it's much cheaper to start allover again. But I'am afraid this one will also loose it's unique character, because of the direction JLR has taken.

In my opinion JLR is losing (or perhaps has lost) it's unique DNA which I truly loved. The market has gained another lookalike car manufacturer but I guess it's the right direction for the shareholder. a defender from 1984 pretending to be a puma with a touch of Range Rover

Post #688350 23rd Feb 2018 7:28am
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BogMonster



Member Since: 05 Feb 2008
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Falkland Islands 2006 Defender 110 300 Tdi SW Tonga Green

Supacat wrote:
I'd like to think you are right but given that JLR have stated they want 100k sales per annum, which is up from their original 50k, then keeping the old guard of @ 10k satisfied must be well down their list of priorities


Click image to enlarge


Defender has evidently been going much longer than I thought Rolling with laughter

If that really is a JLR graph it says a lot about what they understand about their own history these days.... ---
2006 Defender 110 SW 300Tdi • 2011 Ford Ranger XLT crewcab • 2015 Mitsubishi Shogun SG2 • 2015 Defender 110 Station Wagon Utility TDCi

Post #689172 27th Feb 2018 12:32am
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Supacat



Member Since: 16 Oct 2012
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United Kingdom 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS DCPU Keswick Green

No - It's a Bloomberg graph...it's says so in the bottom right corner...the source of the info, i.e., the figures, come from JLR...

Post #689255 27th Feb 2018 12:47pm
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