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dbit

Member Since: 10 Oct 2020
Location: Colorado
Posts: 13

Air Suspensions or Coils on the 2021 D90?

Hey Everyone,

I've been creeping around for about a month learning from all the awesome threads y'all have made so far, just want to take a quick moment to say THANK YOU for helping me learn not only about the new Defender and all the models & options, but also some off-roading basics!

I'm getting ready to lock down a D90 build with a local dealer, but the biggest area of concern for me is the air suspension. I'm primarily getting a defender for day-to-day road use, road trips, and "light off-roading" to remote-ish camp grounds, vista points, trail heads, or random areas of interest (stuff like climbing grassy hills, going through muddy forests, driving on snowy/icy trails, etc). I'm not speccing the build to facilitate rock crawling or intense overlanding; I just want a comfortable, elevated (literally), neat 4x4 that can help me and a friend or two get to whatever remote spot we want to get to.

I'm definitely going for the electronic locking rear diff, and decided today to go for the P400 over the P300, but the suspension's the big question mark for me. I've never owned a 4x4 or SUV specifically due to the "wofty-ness" and springiness of the ride on road, but I found that the D110 I tested to be way more composed than I anticipated. I'm coming from an older gen Audi A4, and while the drive dynamics are night and day, I found the D110 I tested handled curves at speed and swift maneuvers in a completely adequate manner for my taste -- and handled pot holes and rough patches of tarmac way more comfortably than my Audi.

My concern with the springs is that the ride will have those "wofty" or floaty characteristics that seemed minimized by the air suspension, since LR's language indicates that the adaptive dampers as part of the air suspension assembly contribute to the ride feel. The sales rep at the dealership mentioned that the coil-based suspension is most likely tuned for off-road capability and comfort, something concerning to me especially when 90% of my time in the car will be on the highway and in urban areas. I would be absolutely disappointed if I went through the whole exercise of custom ordering a vehicle only to dislike the way the car rides

With air suspension, my worry is all about the memetic unreliability of the system. I don't generally lend much credence to comments on the internet (I see the irony here, don't worry

), but I do wonder why almost every video sporting a LR product is littered with jokes and comments about the brand's lack of reliability. In contrast, I have family who's owned several LR and RR products throughout the years who claim to never have had issues with their air suspension systems ever, but part of me can't help but wonder if perhaps their strict on-road driving habits contribute to the reliable performance they've experienced. I'm no expert, but I would expect that by taking the truck on more varied terrain I'd be putting more stress on the suspension over time, right? I totally concede that this may be one of those areas where highway and city driving might actually put more stress on a vehicle's suspension than a slippery hill might -- please do correct me or chime in if you know something I don't

As mentioned earlier, I have no intention of turning the Defender I buy into a rock crawler or a heavy duty overlander. I could see myself picking up an extra set of wheels with meaty tires for challenging trips, or maybe even swapping out the dampers if I go with coils and find the stock set to not strike a good balance between on and off road use, but that's as far as I think I'd be willing to go when modding the vehicle. In a perfect world where nothing breaks, I would absolutely ride on air instead of coils

I've also accepted that part of owning a LR product means shelling out for parts and labor to replace broken kit on the car, and have no problem replacing, say, the compressor, a handful of suspension air bags, or any associated sensors.

My main concern would be with experiencing a suspension fault while I'm away from cell reception and in a difficult to reach location. I get that life's all about assessing the probabilities of things and making decisions amidst the uncertainty, but as someone new to JLR products, what kind of probabilities are we dealing with here? Is there "preventative care" that could be performed on the car to limit the chance of aging kit giving out in a remote area? I sincerely hope this isn't seen as an elaborate attempt at starting a flame war, but realistically, how unreliable is the air suspension system of modern LR products?

I guess, the final bit I wanted to ask about was the coil-based suspension they're putting on new Defenders itself. I couldn't find any details or information about it since I've started seriously researching the new Defender, but does anyone know what kind of system or what "specs" the coil-based suspension system has? I know next to nothing about suspensions but my thinking was that I could perhaps find a LR/RR product with a similar suspension set up to get a feel for the handling.

Anyway, thanks for reading my very long post, looking forward to your input!

10th Oct 2020 5:49am

Tim in Scotland

Member Since: 23 May 2007
Location: The Land that time forgot
Posts: 3750

I’ve now owned 6 air suspended Land Rover cars since 2002 and I don’t recall ever having had a problem with it, all have been used offroad. I’m not saying it’s immune from faults as I know people who have had sensor problems or early Full Fats, Discoveries and Sports that had compressor problems - usually a blocked filter but LR changed manufacturer of compressors in the early days after a spate of problems. I would say that you are more likely to have electrinics issues elsewhere in the car than with the air springs.
I don’t recall anyone being left stranded by a suspension fault, the car has always been drivable with care.
A neighbour bought a 97,000 miles 2006 Range Rover last November, the compressor had recently been replaced and new pipes fitted as a precaution as we salt roads here in winter and corrosion of pipes on a car that age is likely, so far he’s had no problems with anything but the previous owner maintained the car at a main dealership regardless of cost.
Land Rover have learned a few things with their systems over the years like siting the compressor inside the car so filters don’t draw in dirt/dust. I have my own routine for raising or lowering the car on air springs in that if I can avoid it I don’t raise or lower the car when it is standing still held on the brakes to reduce stress on components, especially going from offroad height to access height or the other way. It’s not strictly necessary but even in Defender I can hear the odd quiet creek or groan from the suspension if I forget. Although New Defender doesn’t have the Dynamic mode in the Terrain Response menu that some of the Range Rover models have the Comfort mode program incorporates some of the aspects of the Dynamic setting. Also New Defender’s air springs are a new design - they are now twin chambers in each doughnut, most times it operates with one chamber inflated and the second chamber is used when the surface gets very rough to stiffen up the suspension as required. Pangea Green D250 90 HSE with Air Suspension, Off-road Pack, Towing Pack, Black Contrast roof , rear recovery eyes, Front bash plate, Classic flaps all round, extended wheel arch kit and a few bits from PowerfulUK Expel Clear Gloss PPF to come
2020 D240 1st Edition in Pangea Green with Acorn interior. Now gone - old faithful, no mechanical issues whatsoever ever but the leaks and rattles all over the place won’t be missed!

10th Oct 2020 9:02am

Naks

Member Since: 27 Jan 2009
Location: Stellenbosch, ZA
Posts: 2586

2010 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 SW Alpine White

Personally, I'll take air suspension over coils any day - the ride is so much more comfortable and the technology has come a long way with reliability

In fact, before C19 I was debating converting my Puma to air suspension...

--
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear
2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged

Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9
Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO
Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ

10th Oct 2020 9:29am

Defendit..

Member Since: 09 Aug 2020
Location: 's-Hertogenbosch
Posts: 366

Welcome dbit,
I've spent a lot of time configuring my P90s
First, no 400 engine, to heavy, complex, no 18" rims available. The P300 is adequate. ( tuningbox will add +15%)
Airsuspension Yes, for comfort and groundclearance. And all the Electronic goodies.TR2 ( I also believe in a better resale value)
Electronic diff, Yes

Color is very personal.. I like Solid paint, unfortunately you can choose every solid color as long It's white.

See my specs in previous post. Who ordered one?

10th Oct 2020 9:30am

J77

Member Since: 04 Nov 2019
Location: Fife
Posts: 3245

If you’re doing off roading then yeah take the air.

On my one though, I won’t be wasting the £1600 for it.

10th Oct 2020 10:03am

Naks

Member Since: 27 Jan 2009
Location: Stellenbosch, ZA
Posts: 2586

If I were to get a 90, this is my build: https://build.landrover/F7598997

but still no availability of the new diesel engines in ZA --
2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear
2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged

Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9
Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO
Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ

10th Oct 2020 11:07am

dbit

Member Since: 10 Oct 2020
Location: Colorado
Posts: 13

Thanks for that comprehensive reply, Tim -- it's a big relief knowing that the vehicle's still drivable even when certain air suspension faults occur.

Defendit, choosing between the P300 and the P400 was a tough one. I like that I can fit smaller wheels on the P300 (the 18" dark gray set look sick), that the powertrain has a much simpler design, and that I can spec that awesome white roof on 90s w/ the P300 here in the states. Unfortunately I found that while the P300 is indeed perfectly adequate as many claim, acceleration from being still felt too slow when in city and suburban areas unless I was willing to rev the engine up. To me, being able to smoothly take off with the P400 and the ability to pick up speed without revving up too high made it the better choice for my use. I did have to go with the x-dynamic trim in order to get that P400

not the biggest fan of the gloss black trim pieces and having to go with 20" wheels. Not much changed between my builds though, still going with Tasman blue + the pano roof, and with a host of electronic + mechanical goodies. I snapped a picture of a P300 with the dark gray 18s while visiting the dealership earlier:

Click image to enlarge

10th Oct 2020 5:09pm

Tim in Scotland

Member Since: 23 May 2007
Location: The Land that time forgot
Posts: 3750

If take off in the P300 isn’t enough you can move the selector to the left and into Sport mode then manually shift of let it go to the Rev limiter and shift up automatically. Pangea Green D250 90 HSE with Air Suspension, Off-road Pack, Towing Pack, Black Contrast roof , rear recovery eyes, Front bash plate, Classic flaps all round, extended wheel arch kit and a few bits from PowerfulUK Expel Clear Gloss PPF to come
2020 D240 1st Edition in Pangea Green with Acorn interior. Now gone - old faithful, no mechanical issues whatsoever ever but the leaks and rattles all over the place won’t be missed!

10th Oct 2020 5:17pm

shanecl

Member Since: 20 Mar 2013
Location: Louth
Posts: 454

1989 Defender 90 V8 Petrol CSW Auto Firenze Red

i loved the air suspension on my disco 2 and plan on putting it into my defender 90 rebuild. would pick it any day over coils

11th Oct 2020 10:29am

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