 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > Puma 2.4 not starting ..... immobiliser??? |
 
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| 4wd-junky Member Since: 31 Aug 2014 Location: UK Posts: 89  
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Didn't start this morning ...... just cranked for a second or two then quit, same as before.
Is there a minimum voltage required by the engine ecu before it shuts down, thus cutting the earth to the starter relay during cranking? |
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29th Jun 2016 11:06am |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16879 
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The IPAC is not famous for being a source of trouble, and generally seems quite reliable.
Does anything happen to the display on the instrument panel when the fault occurs (lights or gauges doing unexpected things)? This could still be a defective or loose main ignition or starter relay under the seat. |
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29th Jun 2016 11:29am |
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| 4wd-junky Member Since: 31 Aug 2014 Location: UK Posts: 89
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Thanks ....... instrument display is totally normal during the starting process.
I have checked the 3 relays under the seat, the engine ecu is definitely cutting the earth to the starter relay coil then cranking stops.....and when I manually activate the starter by removing the relay and triggering the solenoid it cranks but doesn't start. Going to try bump starting it, to rule out the immobiliser once and for all ...... would you agree? |
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29th Jun 2016 11:45am |
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| dorsetsmith Member Since: 30 Oct 2011 Location: South West Posts: 4554 |
can you see crank position sender out put then cranking
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29th Jun 2016 11:53am |
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| custom90 Member Since: 21 Jan 2010 Location: South West, England. Posts: 19578
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Check battery voltage at rest and charging current. Voltage could have an effect, might be worth checking for current draw at rest as well as that could drain the battery if there is something drawing current off it at rest.
Last edited by custom90 on 29th Jun 2016 1:28pm. Edited 1 time in total |
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29th Jun 2016 12:21pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16879
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As Dorsetsmith suggesets, and intermittent output from the crankshaft position sensor could cause this, but would also stop the engine if it wa running. An intermittent output from the camshaft position sensor would have a similar effect on starting but won't affect the engine when it is actually running.
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29th Jun 2016 12:49pm |
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| 4wd-junky Member Since: 31 Aug 2014 Location: UK Posts: 89
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Thanks guys ...... just tried waiting till the glow plug light went out before starting and it did not crank at all ..... nothing.
Have connected the battery charger to top up the battery as was only getting 9.5v when cranking with the glow plugs on, maybe not enough to keep the engine ecu powered up during cranking? Unfortunately, don't have a diagnostic tool yet, trying to pick one at the moment..... is Launch stuff any good? When started it always runs perfectly and has never stopped unexpectedly. |
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29th Jun 2016 1:25pm |
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| hornet Member Since: 04 Jan 2010 Location: Western Europe Posts: 325 |
The manual says, when battery-voltage drops between 6-9V, the function of the injectors will be limited (!) and failures occur:
- misfire engine - uneven idling - reduced power - starting problems - lots of smoke Did you check error memory? (Of course you did  )
Edit: Simply check wit fresh battery if failure still occurs... |
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29th Jun 2016 3:10pm |
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| 4wd-junky Member Since: 31 Aug 2014 Location: UK Posts: 89
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Thanks ...... been looking for that section in the manual,.
As mentioned above, don't have a suitable diagnostic unit yet and currently looking for recommendations both basic and expert. Charging the battery at the moment and also going try another battery as you suggest. Also, it's strange there's not more on the forum about battery performance and the problem I'm experiencing? |
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29th Jun 2016 3:23pm |
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| Lorryman100 Member Since: 01 Oct 2010 Location: Here Posts: 2686 |
replied to pm.
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29th Jun 2016 4:01pm |
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| 4wd-junky Member Since: 31 Aug 2014 Location: UK Posts: 89
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Many Thanks, Brian.
Need to do a bit of reading now  |
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29th Jun 2016 4:06pm |
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| 4wd-junky Member Since: 31 Aug 2014 Location: UK Posts: 89
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I've just went out armed with the information Brian sent me to do some investigating with a DMM, and it started first time without any hesitation. The charger was still connected and I could see there was 10.5v at the battery when cranking with the glow plugs running.
Is it possible that there's a point at which there's just not enough volts at the ECM and it shuts down, resulting in the symptoms I've described? |
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29th Jun 2016 8:21pm |
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| 4wd-junky Member Since: 31 Aug 2014 Location: UK Posts: 89
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Didn't start this morning on a fully charged battery
It behaves exactly the same as before and this: Only thing that has changed from yesterday evening is maybe a small change in ambient temperature. Didn't drive it, move it, did nothing to it. Maybe David & Jason on the youtube video know the answer  |
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30th Jun 2016 10:18am |
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| 4wd-junky Member Since: 31 Aug 2014 Location: UK Posts: 89
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It totally refused to start, tried relays fuses and even jump leads to make sure it wasn't just a bad battery.
Then I disconnected the negative battery terminal for about an hour and it started first time no problem. But, a weird thing happened when I returned from a short test drive, after stopping it and restarting it died out, restarted again and it died out, then next start it stayed going...... could this be related to the starting problem? Also, can someone please explain what gets reset when the battery power is removed as this might be the source of the problem? |
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30th Jun 2016 1:53pm |
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