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spudfan

Member Since: 10 Sep 2007
Location: Co Donegal
Posts: 4493

Perhaps they could approach it in a different light. Keep the old regime for double cabs with a basic but necessary spec for work. If you fit fancy alloys and leather trim this could be claimed as a "non essential"
modification for a working vehicle. Then those who really need it for work would not be penalised.
Policing vehicles to ensure that they do not upgrade after purchase would need to be an MOT check, but no doubt there are ways around this. Shame that those who genuinely need and use such a vehicle just because it was being abused by the lifestyle crowd, 1982 88" 2.25 diesel
1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali
2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu
2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai

15th Feb 2024 4:01pm

pjm-84

Member Since: 12 Apr 2021
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 642

markb110 wrote:
Around here in this estate (21 years old now) there is a covenant that excludes the homeowners from parking a van overnight.

This lead to three owners that I am aware of to go over to pickups and move the vans to other employees than didn’t have the same issue.

With all the new estates that are being thrown up left right and centre this must affect others as well.

At the moment what is the alternative, apart from paying the tax, an EV van would still not be allowed overnight around here.

I have the same issue and no problem with my VW T5....coming up to 9yrs and counting but it does have windows. An neighbour around the back brings home the company dropside transit

On the other side of the coin the few I know with crew cab pickups are purely using these due to the BIK benefit.

16th Feb 2024 12:18am

I Like Old Skool

Member Since: 23 Feb 2015
Location: Manchester
Posts: 768

1994 Defender 110 300 Tdi ST Coniston Green

Little or no sympathy for the owners of this class of vehicle!

As an owner of a 4x4 it may seem strange, but I actually abhor the 4x4. I detest the Discovery and the Range Rover status symbols. I feel the waste of resource that goes into powering the road going TRUCKS that these vehicles represent when a good estate car would do the same job.

One of my cycling buddies owns a Ford Ranger, all the bells and whistles, it's an impressive piece of kit. He's an f'ing accountant for God's sake! It may be tax efficient but it is killing the planet for no other reason than self gratification and tax write-offs!

Mrs I Like Old Skool has always displayed a liking for the Vag 4x4 products and similar (Tiguan/Q3/Ford Kuga etc) but I have always vehemently rejected this as a gross waste of resources when a saloon or hatch back can suffice. Even when it snows, I will often take out our front wheel drive Audi A4 because it is more than capable and if I am going to be stuck in traffic for hours then I might as well be comfortable and efficient? Why would I choose to power around in an enormous slab of 4x4 lard when a typical saloon car will suffice?

It might be unpleasant for current owners, but wake up and smell the coffee, your little tax dodge has come to an end. Time to pick-up the bill! (see what I did there?).

16th Feb 2024 1:00am

Jabberwocky

Member Since: 27 Oct 2021
Location: Luxembourg
Posts: 195

I’m just glad I live in a free society and anti 4x4 bores can go sit on something sharp.🤷‍♂️ I’ll buy whatever I want because I get to decide what car I want not some self appointed car stasi.

16th Feb 2024 2:06am

TexasRover

Member Since: 24 Nov 2022
Location: Paris
Posts: 798

2002 Defender 110 Td5 DCPU Chawton White

I think Jabber you will find you are restricted in what you can buy by all sorts of rules in you European country. Safety environment etc will put restrictions on say some boxy Toyota truck or a Jimny.

Then there are the incentives or decentiveses used to encourage or discourage certain behaviour typically with money. For private buyers there is little discount, but business buyers have carved out a nice little racket for themselves.

If you ask me we have made the world way to complicated

16th Feb 2024 6:10am

Chicken Drumstick

Member Since: 17 Aug 2020
Location: Near MK
Posts: 548

I Like Old Skool wrote:
One of my cycling buddies owns a Ford Ranger, all the bells and whistles, it's an impressive piece of kit. He's an f'ing accountant for God's sake! It may be tax efficient but it is killing the planet for no other reason than self gratification and tax write-offs!.

You sound quite deluded. The difference a pick up makes in the grand scheme is probably not even measurable.

And if you truly cared, you’d not be using a smartphone or computer or posting on the internet. Do you have any clue to the resources all of those require? Housing, heating, clothes and farmed foods should all be off your list too as permissible. If you aren’t prepared to really stick by such ludicrous claims. The. You should not judge others either if they make different lifestyle decisions.

16th Feb 2024 9:10am

kenzle8a

Member Since: 12 Feb 2020
Location: None
Posts: 1074

I Like Old Skool wrote:
Little or no sympathy for the owners of this class of vehicle!

As an owner of a 4x4 it may seem strange, but I actually abhor the 4x4. I detest the Discovery and the Range Rover status symbols. I feel the waste of resource that goes into powering the road going TRUCKS that these vehicles represent when a good estate car would do the same job.

One of my cycling buddies owns a Ford Ranger, all the bells and whistles, it's an impressive piece of kit. He's an f'ing accountant for God's sake! It may be tax efficient but it is killing the planet for no other reason than self gratification and tax write-offs!

Mrs I Like Old Skool has always displayed a liking for the Vag 4x4 products and similar (Tiguan/Q3/Ford Kuga etc) but I have always vehemently rejected this as a gross waste of resources when a saloon or hatch back can suffice. Even when it snows, I will often take out our front wheel drive Audi A4 because it is more than capable and if I am going to be stuck in traffic for hours then I might as well be comfortable and efficient? Why would I choose to power around in an enormous slab of 4x4 lard when a typical saloon car will suffice?

It might be unpleasant for current owners, but wake up and smell the coffee, your little tax dodge has come to an end. Time to pick-up the bill! (see what I did there?).

I must ask, what do you do that requires a Defender to have such a stanuch hatred of any other 4x4? I only know one other farmer that still runs a Defender as opposed to a Hilux, Ranger or D-Max. Some of them even run Discovery 3/4 commercials in place of a Defender as they are better for daily life.

We've had Defenders, Range Rovers and were looking at a Touareg or Cayenne diesel for our uses, as to be honest in most ways the modern 4x4s are better to live with.

Now don't get me wrong the best vehicle ive ever owned was my TD5 double cab. It did everything on the farm and more. However my wife stuggled to drive it, it was awful on the motorway and it struggled with our largest horse trailer. My TDV8 Range Rover on the other hand was a breeze for my wife to drive, pulled the tailer like it wasn't there, was better in most regards than a Discovery 3 and cost the same for me to buy second hand.

16th Feb 2024 10:00am

pjm-84

Member Since: 12 Apr 2021
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 642

Trust me my carbon footprint is small and probably smaller than most who demand action. I'm not here to say look at me and or to judge.

The irony of targeting a SUV is somewhat misplaced from someone who is involved in construction / energy efficiency measures / low carbon / new buildings / renewables.

The tax is not a dodge but a current provision under the current system. This is being closed down.

Just like EVs don't currently pay VED but will do so in 2025. Its not a dodge

16th Feb 2024 12:31pm

spudfan

Member Since: 10 Sep 2007
Location: Co Donegal
Posts: 4493

I have been known to play the "GREEN" card the odd time to get out of a sticky situation. Take for instance when the Mrs starts flashing those amorous glances and dropping unsubtle hints in the "nookie" line. How does the save the planet thing work here you ask?
Well I argue about all of those calories that would be used and have to be replenished. "Think of all of those methane emitting farting cattle to be turned into burgers to help me get my strength back. All of that processing and transportation. Hard as it is (no pun intended) but we should think of the planet." 1982 88" 2.25 diesel
1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali
2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu
2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai

16th Feb 2024 5:19pm

Co1

Member Since: 19 Aug 2018
Location: North Yorkshire
Posts: 3618

I Like Old Skool wrote:
Little or no sympathy for the owners of this class of vehicle!

As an owner of a 4x4 it may seem strange, but I actually abhor the 4x4. I detest the Discovery and the Range Rover status symbols. I feel the waste of resource that goes into powering the road going TRUCKS that these vehicles represent when a good estate car would do the same job.

One of my cycling buddies owns a Ford Ranger, all the bells and whistles, it's an impressive piece of kit. He's an f'ing accountant for God's sake! It may be tax efficient but it is killing the planet for no other reason than self gratification and tax write-offs!

Mrs I Like Old Skool has always displayed a liking for the Vag 4x4 products and similar (Tiguan/Q3/Ford Kuga etc) but I have always vehemently rejected this as a gross waste of resources when a saloon or hatch back can suffice. Even when it snows, I will often take out our front wheel drive Audi A4 because it is more than capable and if I am going to be stuck in traffic for hours then I might as well be comfortable and efficient? Why would I choose to power around in an enormous slab of 4x4 lard when a typical saloon car will suffice?

It might be unpleasant for current owners, but wake up and smell the coffee, your little tax dodge has come to an end. Time to pick-up the bill! (see what I did there?).

As someone that has owned both DC picks ups and defenders, I’d love your view on what I should buy instead. I need a 4x4 with 4 seats (don’t need a fifth of that helps?) load space to carry about half a ton max. I also need to be able to put dogs in the back, sheep in the back, horse muck in the back, pheasant feed in the back and building materials (sand, hardcore, blocks etc) in the back. Not all at once mind.

I only have space for 1 vehicle, so couldn’t have a hatchback and a van, or trailer. I do about 14,000 miles a year. What do you think?

16th Feb 2024 7:35pm

markb110

Member Since: 22 May 2010
Location: Guildford
Posts: 2524

Never let the brainwashing get in the way of facts

?si=4TP5F7ZqUADXh5NB

16th Feb 2024 8:59pm

spudfan

Member Since: 10 Sep 2007
Location: Co Donegal
Posts: 4493

Well I am afraid to say, that as of last night the planet is doomed

1982 88" 2.25 diesel
1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali
2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu
2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai

18th Feb 2024 1:33am

Procta

Member Since: 04 Dec 2016
Location: Sunderland
Posts: 4940

yep we are all doomed. Spuds pal. Defender TD5 90 ---/--- Peugeot 306 HDI hatch back

Success is 90% Inspiration and 4 minutes Preparation # you can make it!

18th Feb 2024 2:22am

blackwolf

Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 16892

2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey

spudfan wrote:
Well I am afraid to say, that as of last night the planet is doomed

The planet's fine, the human race is doomed. The planet will be here long after we've gone.

18th Feb 2024 10:24am

RFT

Member Since: 13 Nov 2010
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 674

2010 Defender 130 Puma 2.4 HCPU Zermatt Silver

U turn made
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/update-...p-guidance 130 Puma HCPU with an Artica 240LR Demountable Camper

19th Feb 2024 8:36pm

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