 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > Rattle on start / intermittent power loss |
 
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| Phid Member Since: 25 May 2018 Location: Dorset Posts: 85  
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Ref 2. I have noticed there is diesel on the bottom right hand side of the fuel tank. Could this indicate breather pipe issue?
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6th Jun 2018 8:52pm |
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| Phid Member Since: 25 May 2018 Location: Dorset Posts: 85
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Another symptom just identified.
Sometimes on start up it’s stopping itself straight away. No faults showing on code reader. |
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7th Jun 2018 9:29am |
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| Phid Member Since: 25 May 2018 Location: Dorset Posts: 85
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Another update...
The turbo boost sensor was filthy. Have cleaned that and replaced and car runs noticeably better. The symptoms described haven't returned but I haven't done too many miles. I guess if readings from the sensor were wrong due to the muck it would result in what I have been experiencing. That said it did repeat the start up and stop itself fault. Strange one. The start up rattle is coming from the gearbox according to my mate who was lying under the car to listen. I thought about checking the gearbox oil was at the right level which normally you would do by filling until overflowing from the fill hole. Am I right in saying you can't do this on a Defender? |
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7th Jun 2018 10:32am |
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| Tdi4 Member Since: 24 Oct 2014 Location: Houten Posts: 513  
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Yes unfortunately.
And you're a lucky man if it's just the sensor 
if not just PM me, I went through the process of three years trying to solve the problem. Which I did by the way a defender from 1984 pretending to be a puma with a touch of Range Rover |
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7th Jun 2018 10:40am |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16876 
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When you get the start/stop rattle, do you have the clutch in or out?
If the clutch is in, then it may well be the infamous Puma clutch "Death Rattle" especially on a vehicle the age of yours. The early Puma clutches were almost completely unfit for purpose and seldom last more than a few thousand miles (my '07 had three new clutches in the first three years). If it is the death rattle then you will hear it is you stop the engine with the clutch in, you will not hear it is you stop the engine with the clutch out. There are other failing components which can also do this (for example the infamous gearbox output adaptor shaft, another component which is scarcely fit for purpose) but the clutch is the most likely. If you conclude that it is the clutch, change it or get it changed without delay since the repair gets much more expensive when the driven plate sheds its springs. |
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7th Jun 2018 10:58am |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16876
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Yes, it indicates a perished breather, but it is unlikely to be the cause of your other symptoms. |
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7th Jun 2018 10:58am |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16876
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You can't do this on a TDCi (Puma) Defender with the MT82 gearbox although you can on most other Defenders. With the Puma, the filler hole is not a level hole, so really the only way to check the level is to drain the gearbox and refill with a measured quantity. That's progress for you! In practice history suggests that more Pumas have overfilled gearboxes than underfilled, and unless there are obvious signs of a leak it is unlikely to be the problem. |
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7th Jun 2018 11:01am |
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| Phid Member Since: 25 May 2018 Location: Dorset Posts: 85
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Thanks for the feedback and advice.
Blackwolf: In terms of the start up rattle, I am not pressing the clutch down when I start the car or when I turn it off. If I depress the clutch the rattle goes away both on start on stop. I'm guessing this is the clutch death rattle and I need a new clutch? After the initial rattle the engine sounds fine. When the engine is running there is no rattle either with the clutch pressed down or not. |
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7th Jun 2018 11:28am |
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| Phid Member Since: 25 May 2018 Location: Dorset Posts: 85
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Also, if it is the clutch - any idea how much to replace at a local independent?
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7th Jun 2018 11:46am |
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| dorsetsmith Member Since: 30 Oct 2011 Location: South West Posts: 4554 |
you just picked up my first Defender - an ‘07 puma from dealer ?
blackberry problems  Last edited by dorsetsmith on 7th Jun 2018 12:18pm. Edited 1 time in total |
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7th Jun 2018 11:51am |
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| Phid Member Since: 25 May 2018 Location: Dorset Posts: 85
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Sorry DorsetSmith - are you asking if I got it from a dealer or highlighting the coincidence that you're in Dorset and have just bought and 07 Puma?
Yes mine is from a small independent dealer - but not close by. Any work I will get done close to home (nr Wimborne) but the dealer will be picking up the cost. |
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7th Jun 2018 11:55am |
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| dorsetsmith Member Since: 30 Oct 2011 Location: South West Posts: 4554 |
You have answer my questions your land rover from a small independent dealer and not a private sale and that the dealer will be picking up the cost.
get gear box out put shaft checked same time  |
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7th Jun 2018 12:07pm |
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| MikeJ Member Since: 04 May 2014 Location: Dorchester, Dorset Posts: 41 
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 Click image to enlarge I'm not sure that the clutch rattle is always immediate and fatal. I've got a 130 with a cherry picker on the back that has rattled for 2 years without problems. (it will probably explode now!) It spends its whole life idling in 4th gear with the transfer box in neutral to run the PTO for the hydraulics. So I would say if the dealer will fit a new clutch, go for it, but it probably won't fail immediately. Cheers Mike |
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7th Jun 2018 1:13pm |
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| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16876
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That is correct. Usually the rattle is most noticeable when switching the engine off. If it is the clutch, it will not rattle if you stop the engine with the clutch out (ie foot pressing pedal). The rattle is caused by the springs in the clutch plate taking on a permanent set and becoming loose in their pockets. There are two problems which may develop if this is not rectified, firstly the springs ultimately are likely to fall out and lodge between the flywheel and clutch cover, rendering the vehicle undrivable and potentially causing further damage. Secondly, the springs will fail properly to absorb torsional vibrations from the engine and will fail to smooth clutch take-up, both of which can cause damage to the rest of the notoriously fragile Puma driveline and precipitate output shaft failure, diff and propshaft wear, and especially halfshaft and drive flange wear. So whilst it is true that you can run with a rattly clutch for quite some time, it is somewhat risky. Changing the clutch is not difficult and doesn't take long, the biggest impediment is the sheer size and weight of the Defender transmission. As noted above, whilst doing a clutch change it would be exceptionally foolish not to split the transfer box and main gearbox in order to inspect and lubricate the output adaptor shaft splined joint, which is probably the Achilles Heel of the driveline. The good news is that on a 2007 vehicle, especially one with such low mileage, it is probably in excellent condition (later models were known to fail in as little as 5k miles). Make sure that the splines are copiously lubricated with a molybdenum disulphide grease on reassembly and properly assembled afterwards though, or consider fitting the Ashcroft Transmissions self-lubricating upgrade). |
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7th Jun 2018 3:34pm |
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