 | Home > Puma (Tdci) > Puma reliability? |
 
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| Naks Member Since: 27 Jan 2009 Location: Stellenbosch, ZA Posts: 2599   
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the more I spend time under the Puma at my indie's workshop, the more appalled I am at the sh*tty build quality and bad design
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2010 Defender Puma 90 + BAS remap + Alive IC + Slickshift + Ashcroft ATB rear 2015 Range Rover Sport V8 Supercharged 
Defender Puma Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zZ1en9 Discovery 4 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zXrtKO Range Rover/Sport L320/L322/L494 Workshop Manual: https://bit.ly/2zc58JQ |
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6th Apr 2011 6:02am |
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| Setok Member Since: 16 Jan 2009 Location: Helsinki Posts: 415 
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I'd be interested to hear the main design faults and how they should be remedied.
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6th Apr 2011 11:10am |
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| Happyoldgit Member Since: 14 Sep 2007 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3471  
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Design? Seems more like a pitifully slow evolution to me
 Steve.
Owned numerous Land Rover vehicles of all shapes and sizes over the decades. Current Defender: A non tarts hand-bagged Puma 110 XS USW. [Insert something impressive here such as extensive list of previous Land Rovers or examples of your prestigeous and expensive items, trinkets, houses, bikes, vehicles etc] http://forums.lr4x4.com I used to be Miserable ...but now I'm ecstatic. |
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6th Apr 2011 11:37am |
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| AlanH Member Since: 15 Mar 2010 Location: WA Posts: 242 
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I would really love another Defender and so would the cook, but the more we hear of the problems owners have with a vehicle which really should have been well and truly sorted many years ago, the more we think we should look at Toyota.
I said on AULRO about a year ago I'd start looking at the Defender to replace the plastic Prado about now, especially if the lack of back-up in remote regions (and we've got lots of them in Oz) had been addressed, but nothing has been done. However, I went out a couple of days ago to look at a second hand Puma (TDCi) but it was way too expensive and the salesman were hiding in their airconned offices. Same with the Tojo main stealer. And with the LR stealer here in Perth (there's two but they're owned by the same bloke), no one would venture out to talk to me. It's either my scruffy pants or the weather but believe me 34C ain't that hot here. So it's obviously me, maybe I'd better buy some fancy pants before I venture forth next time. 
AlanH. |
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6th Apr 2011 11:38am |
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| ralton Member Since: 04 Feb 2010 Location: Durban Posts: 153 
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gosh i dunno hey... i'm scared to say anything in case it comes back to haunt me.
but, besides a clutch failure (and that was only because the idiots replaced the standard recalled clutch with that same old spec clutch), and a few small odds and ends under warranty, i've done 100 000km and am so very happy with my puma! i love getting into it every day to drive to work. i love going away every other weekend and every other travel opportunity i get. i love adding accesories to it. i love looking at it (including its warts and battle wounds and panel gaps). it's smooth, and powerful, and strong and goes absolutely anywhere (places i would never have imagined it could). what a wonderful vehicle! www.ralton.co.za |
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6th Apr 2011 12:17pm |
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| ken Member Since: 18 Aug 2009 Location: Banging Birds with my bitches !! Posts: 4328
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Well my dealer refuses to accept the clutch is Fooked
They missed the gearbox leak They missed the leak on top of the fuel tank Guess who won’t be getting the next LR order (this is a case of aftersales killing sales) |
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6th Apr 2011 12:27pm |
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| Setok Member Since: 16 Jan 2009 Location: Helsinki Posts: 415
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The reason I ask about design faults is that a lot of people talk about them, but when asked specifically what design faults are 'clearly wrong' and what sort of design would work better, I don't tend to get many responses. I know there are those funny little Landy things, like panel gaps, but that's mostly just aesthetic. Also the handbrake might be in an odd position, but it doesn't really affect its operation. So I'm really looking for stuff like "They use joint type X, which is clearly wrong and weak, and they should use type Y instead".
So if you were out there to improve on the Landy, with the mission of making it better at its job (tougher, more reliable), what changes should be made. If it's just comfort and aesthetics, I'm not too fussed. |
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6th Apr 2011 12:48pm |
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| MK Member Since: 28 Aug 2008 Location: Santiago Posts: 2266  
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rear door: brakes with vibration
hand brake position: uncomfortable position axle breathers: cheap design mud flap supports: brake on 110" heat isolation: obvious rubber seals: idem brakes: not quite resposive driving position: elbow room, pedals not aligned with the rest of the body that is about it IMO Puma 110" SW ............................................................. Earth first. Other planets later |
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6th Apr 2011 2:01pm |
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| DefenderOfTheEarth Member Since: 09 Nov 2010 Location: Cornwall, UK Posts: 1304 
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If they radically changed it I can guarantee you'd all be up in arms.
Yes it needs better corrosion resistance and maybe a bit more poke but other than that I'm very happy with ours. Also seems the best received vehicle we have ever had from other road users, friends and family. That counts for a lot. Just snow foamed (and jet washed) the underside of ours ready for some self applied Waxoyl. Wish me luck! Defender 110XS SW gone... now VW California 180 4 Motion. |
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6th Apr 2011 4:00pm |
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| Eduardo Member Since: 28 Aug 2008 Location: Región Metropolitana Posts: 2109 
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Agree with MK.
Will be good to see some not too expensive modifications that keep the defender almos unchanged and that can help a lot. In special Im upset with the rear mudflaps. The support trough the lateral panel are not designed to receive the punishment of several kilometers of gravel roads and finally broke the eyelet of the panel in the 110". Also I knows several cases in were the rear door hinges broken. Door rubber seals are really bad quality and losses every 10,000 km. To solve this issues you dont need a radical change, just improve some things. Eduardo MY 2007 110 SW PUMA 2.4: Big Fog of 64' MY 1994 Jayco 1207 Folding camper: "El Tremendo" Click image to enlarge |
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6th Apr 2011 6:47pm |
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| Setok Member Since: 16 Jan 2009 Location: Helsinki Posts: 415
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I agree that the mudflap bits look really flimsy, but these are almost confirming my point. Most issues are related to comfort or are relatively minor. Axle breathers were mentioned, but a cheap design is not inherently bad. So what is the problem with them and how should it be fixed? I also agree that it would be good to have something more substantial carrying the spare wheel.
So are there actual design flaws in the really important stuff: transmission, engine, chassis? Stuff where you can say "The design of the clutch should not be this, it should be this"? Otherwise basic improvements like dealing with bi-metal corrosion and dealing with (apparently?) weak rust protection should definitely be on the To Do list. Mind you, when you look at those old Series Landies, there are things I really envy. Galvanised parts, tougher door handles, nice rocker switches, simpler window design... They just feel more solid and seem to go on forever. |
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6th Apr 2011 10:39pm |
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| Chesby Member Since: 04 Apr 2011 Location: Hughenden Valley, Bucks Posts: 1 
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I have only owned my defender 90 X-Tech for a week now so can't comment on the reliability as yet but I bought the defender knowing I would have to address some weaknesses in the design, namely putting in a bulkhead relacement bar and MUD seat rails so I can get comfortable. I received it back today and its now perfectly comfortable. I wasn't upset with having to do this and consider it part of the charm.
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8th Apr 2011 5:06pm |
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| warren Member Since: 14 Oct 2009 Location: East Lancs. Posts: 903  
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I'm not sure if I could say mine has been reliable...
Looking back through all the workshop reports and paperwork..... 12185 miles - Lost Power Steering, Land Rover Assistance came out within the hour and sorted that. 14353 miles - Got nice damp footwells in the rain, paint peeling off the roof seam, fuel filter cover rattling, door lock siezed. All repaired under warranty. 17345 miles - Roll pin in the rear diff snapped. Repaired under warranty. 20312 miles - Lost all drive. LRA came out and recovered to the dealer. Transfer box output shaft splines worn. Got a tasty top of the range brand new Freelander for a week. Repaired under warranty. 20455 miles - Oil leaking through main gearbox output shaft. Repaired under warranty. 22133 miles - Had my keys stolen, new keys and remote fob + programming. £100. Not the cars fault. 22451 miles - Driving along the M65 and pick up a hefty stone chip in the windscreen. Autoglass replaced, £65 excess to pay. 29421 miles - Lots of transmission backlash. Paint peeling off the roof seam again. Gearbox output shaft splines worn, new gearbox fitted. Repaired under warranty. 29642 miles - Driving along the A59 at dusk, headlights failed. LRA attended and recovered to the dealer. Dip dim relay fault. Got a very nice brand new Disco 4 to use. Repaired under warranty. 30510 miles - Backlash is back! Diffs fine, but exessive play in the off side rear half shaft and drive flange... had to order parts in which took a few days 31321 miles - Rear halfshaft and drive flange replaced OK, the windscreen and keys aren't exactly the cars fault (apart from being in the wrong place at the wrong time, but even then I don't think I can blame the car...). If it carries on though I'm seriously going to consider getting shut... As has been mentioned before you do buy one knowing it's not going to be perfect, it's part of the charm I guess. But when it's stuff that should be right from day one it's a bit of a poor do. |
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8th Apr 2011 7:08pm |
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| JaffaTheNeste Member Since: 02 May 2010 Location: Helsinki Posts: 10 
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I'm on my second Puma at the moment.
Drove 50t.km with my - 07 model. I think i had a lot of recalls on the car. The oil pan was changed during the first service with some clearance damage? 
Then after 35t.Km the vacuum pump failed and the seal between transfer box and rear driveshaft failed also. Atf and engine oil everywhere. (In Finland we usually say a Landy marks her territory. Actually got a notice from the janitor.  )
Heating problem on passenger side, a recall but dealer never fixed it. After that a ecu upgrade was on the shedule.(Radio went haywire after.) Clutch Failed at 40t.Km. Rear door was bent from the top and letting snow in. Lights master switch melted, not under warranty anymore, canged the part myself. 233€ from the dealer. For the part... wtf?
But after all this the car never ever let me down or really got me stranded anywhere. Just traded her in for a 110 Safari Van.(Finnish variant.) 16t.km on clock at the moment. Same heating problem on this one, nothing else at the moment. I had three Td5's before theese two and never had any problems with them. But totally understand the first cars of the new lineup to have some quirks. This is my 5# Defender, and will drive one as long we use fossil fuels. Last edited by JaffaTheNeste on 9th Apr 2011 12:30am. Edited 1 time in total |
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8th Apr 2011 7:55pm |
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