 | Home > Off Topic > Farming subsidies |
 
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| Cupboard Member Since: 21 Mar 2014 Location: Suffolk Posts: 2971   
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On a lot of farms the subsidy money is the profit. The farm by itself just about breaks even then future investment is made possible by subsidies.
The farm I used to work on used to produce a lot of beef. Subsidies for beef production came in, and overnight the price dropped by the same amount. All farm subsidies are doing is subsidising the supermarkets and creating paperwork. Targeted cash to solve specific problems is useful, but just chucking cash at everyone is unhelpful. I think most British farmers would like to be able to farm without subsidies, however getting to that point is very difficult. If you stop UK subsidies but the rest of Europe still has them, then suddenly our farmers become massively undercompetitive. It's the sort of thing you need to do as a group, but what was always going to be a difficult job is soon going to become an impossible one. If it makes anyone feel better about subsidies, they are all linked to following good agricultural practices and the higher payments are all for looking after the environment. |
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27th Mar 2017 9:57pm |
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| lambert.the.farmer Member Since: 11 Apr 2012 Location: harrogate Posts: 2006  
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Because of the somewhat vain hope that things will get better when the population finally work out that cheap food is an oxymoron. The only real saving grace for me is that as of now I don't have a following generation to worry about preserving the business for. Rhubarb and custard let fly with their secret weapon.
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28th Mar 2017 6:01am |
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| Rickydodah Member Since: 14 Jul 2014 Location: East Sussex Posts: 1091 |
Thankfully when we leave the EU we can return to being a leader in agriculture. The CAP is great if you're French or German or an Italian wine producer but IMO does little for UK farmers. I know the MMB all those years ago wasn't great but it did give a common pricing structure for dairy produce and the producer rather than the processors got the lion's share of any "profit". Other than that I believe farmers should receive subsidies as it helps to even out the bad years and the good and because of the very nature of agriculture can take an almost glacial time for change to take place. The rural nature of the UK could be lost forever if failing farms are allowed to go under with the increasing pressure for housing. The stewardship schemes have been a boon to the environment and no longer do we see hedgerows ripped out particulary where I am on the south downs where soil erosion was taking place at an alarming pace and you could see your topsoil literally being blown away. 50 years ago Sussex was mainly dairy and now sheep have taken over, even my local council have their own flock, the issue now is over production with some markets turning away wagons loaded with sheep as they can't cope with the numbers. As a result prices are rock bottom and the temptation is then to export live animals, which I think is abhorrent incidentally, to try and minimise the loss. Most farmers I know would like to be in a break even situation and would look forward to returning to the days when a profit was shown and subsidised farming is the only way to ensure we continue to produce any home grown food and keep the countryside looking the way we expect it to.
Buy British, or as they say use it or loose it.  I started with nothing and still have most of it left! |
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28th Mar 2017 9:19am |
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| Happyoldgit Member Since: 14 Sep 2007 Location: Norfolk Posts: 3471 
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 Steve.
Owned numerous Land Rover vehicles of all shapes and sizes over the decades. Current Defender: A non tarts hand-bagged Puma 110 XS USW. [Insert something impressive here such as extensive list of previous Land Rovers or examples of your prestigeous and expensive items, trinkets, houses, bikes, vehicles etc] http://forums.lr4x4.com I used to be Miserable ...but now I'm ecstatic. |
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28th Mar 2017 4:30pm |
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| need4speed Member Since: 23 Nov 2012 Location: Kilmarnock Posts: 746 |
I'm not a farmer. I don't even know any. But what I do know is not all seem to struggle.
Maybe it's a regional thing but all the farmers round my area seem to do very well indeed. New range rovers every year. New tractors. Lovely house. New outbuildings etc. The one closest to me has even recently got a new mono blocked drive about 1/2 mile long with illuminated electric gates at the road end. And I'm not kidding! |
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28th Mar 2017 5:37pm |
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| lambert.the.farmer Member Since: 11 Apr 2012 Location: harrogate Posts: 2006
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The bigger the outfit the comfier the going on. If like us you're small the more painful the existence. Rhubarb and custard let fly with their secret weapon.
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28th Mar 2017 5:51pm |
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| JJ Member Since: 18 May 2009 Location: Winchester Posts: 932 
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Just to highlight the fact that the bigger you are the more you get
Top recipients Recipient name Amount TATE & LYLE EUROPE (031583) €594,270,084 TATE & LYLE EUROPE €170,957,385 MEADOW FOODS LTD €127,223,714 C CZARNIKOW SUGAR LTD €99,316,783 NIDCO FOODS 1992 DIV OF FAYREFIELD €96,771,940 I think if anyone believes Brexit will change this is deluded. The govenment will absolutely allow the Americans to push their gm crops on us from the dust bowl ( read environmentally destroyed ) areas and signicantly undercut our smaller producers . It will be hailed as a great trade deal ( the one the EU wouldn't do ). HR064 Hampshire and Berkshire 4x4 Response |
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28th Mar 2017 7:19pm |
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| JWL Member Since: 26 Oct 2011 Location: Hereford Posts: 3443 
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Therefore to help put British Farming back where it should be then the public of the UK can get off their backsides and buy their produce from our producers, that way the public can see where their food comes from, they demand the quality that UK farming can produce, stop cheap sub standard GM foods coming in and in turn this will lift the need for all the subsidies.
People do need to relearn about seasonality even though this can be stretched with the use of growing under plastic and greenhouses. So give the farmers a demand for produce and they will respond, take away the subsidies for keeping so much land out of production and let the farmers get on with what they do best, feed the country |
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28th Mar 2017 8:34pm |
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| Huttopia Member Since: 23 Feb 2016 Location: West Midlands Posts: 1968
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Need4Speed 'I'm not a farmer. I don't even know any. But what I do know is not all seem to struggle.
Maybe it's a regional thing but all the farmers round my area seem to do very well indeed. New range rovers every year. New tractors. Lovely house. New outbuildings etc. The one closest to me has even recently got a new mono blocked drive about 1/2 mile long with illuminated electric gates at the road end. And I'm not kidding! ' That is a tired narrative. If I had a pound for everytime I heard the phrase 'farmer and new range rover' I'd have a new range rover (I wouldn't they are too complicated). The point is that as in all walks of life some will do well and others will struggle, it might be birthright, it might be talent, it my be graft or a combination of all three but dear god please can someone come up with a better reference point than a new range rover. |
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28th Mar 2017 8:57pm |
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| need4speed Member Since: 23 Nov 2012 Location: Kilmarnock Posts: 746 |
It may well be a tired narrative but it's an accurate one.
I meant it as a fact round my way. By that I mean they all genuinely do have new range rovers. And they get replaced every couple of years.. So. As they say. If the shoe fits........ |
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28th Mar 2017 10:31pm |
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| boode Member Since: 11 Apr 2012 Location: Devon Posts: 421 
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As you admit that you do not know any farmers - how can you state as a Fact that they all drive new Range Rovers
Can you recognise a farmer driving an old Volvo or a Ford or a Defender as a farmer ? Are the People with the large new drives farmers ? or rich people who have bought a big house in the country ? To state that they all genuinely have New Range Rovers (without knowing any farmers ) is as ridiculous as it is insulting |
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28th Mar 2017 10:48pm |
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| mse Member Since: 06 Apr 2008 Location: UK Posts: 5024 
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My experience (and we are just buying a small holding and know a number of farmers, but are by no means an expert) is there is a difference between farmer and land owner...size of farms play in to it too, as above - also many farmers i know are land rich but cash poor - the price of machinery is high, but cash in the bank low etc. we have no way enough land, for example, to make a sheep flock cover much more than its cost.
I know there is money in some things but no it others - but the cost of kit, feed etc is eye watering and the work is hard. Some land owners with big farms do ok - some also dont and need all activities to make the land pay What is a shame and we in the UK are really bad - where europe isnt, we dont have a local network - we go to supermarkets etc where things are sourced... we have very few small villages with little shops people visit and things come from local suppliers. its a real shame we rely on the internet and big generic chains. there needs to be a big shift in the UK from large bland chains, to local supply - extend that to robots and machine to local people and local jobs - if we can balance tech and people, local supply and distribution we will do ourselves favours in the long run i think. Mike |
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29th Mar 2017 1:09am |
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| Maris Widgeon Member Since: 11 Dec 2013 Location: Cotswolds Posts: 216 
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There is a new web based sales scheme which is matching farmers produce to buyers throughout the UK and has so far been very successful. This sort of scheme helps farmers enter the market without the massive overheads of a farm shop ,or retail business normally needed to sell directly to the public.
Looks good and is gathering a healthy following. Wwwfarmdrop.com Nick |
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29th Mar 2017 7:17am |
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| Riverboy Member Since: 16 May 2016 Location: French sector, Earth Posts: 1288 
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Thats something I noticed quite soon after moving here 13 years ago, that small shops and local markets seem to survive quite well alongside the big sheds, but even in the big supermarkets much of the produce is locally sourced, so what one Hypermarket stocks probably can't be found in any other of the same chain. Thankfully things have improved somewhat when it comes to finding food from home. They all sell Cheddar cheese now, Wykes Farm and their own branded Cheddars but made in the UK. Lots of other products too which we all happily pay far too much for.
My little village is a classic example. We have two bakeries, a butcher, a couple of green grocers, a mini supermarket, a tabac and many more small businesses plus the weekly market which all appear to survive quite happily even after a medium size supermarket opened two years ago on the edge of the village, and its only a 20 minute drive to all the big sheds. |
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29th Mar 2017 5:29pm |
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