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Wild Card 90



Member Since: 03 Dec 2014
Location: Gerlingen
Posts: 845

England 2012 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 SW Indus Silver
Double Cab Mercedes G

Iīm not absolutely convinced that a DC version is under this disguise. However if they do release the "new" G in a DC version, in addition to two wheelbasew versions of Stationwagon, it will fit in just fine.


Click image to enlarge


Land Rover, you better hurry up now!

http://www.motor1.com/news/133659/mercedes-g-class-pickup-spied/

Stephen 1998 Tdi 90 SW,
2008 Td4 90 SW,
2012 2.2 90 SW,
2" raised Trailmaster/Terrafirma
Heavy Track Raids, 255 MTīs,
Recaro CSīs, anorak, wellingtons

Post #593749 17th Jan 2017 8:36am
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What puddle?



Member Since: 25 Oct 2013
Location: Reading
Posts: 495

United Kingdom 1998 Defender 90 V8 Petrol 50th Auto Atlantis Blue

Still no one has been able to explain to me why it is taking LR sooo long. If this were some electric, class-changing vehicle, set to revolutionise the way we travel, then I might understand it...a bit. But it's just a simple 4x4 - isn't it? If Mercedes price the new G Wagen properly, and if Ford really do release a global 'Defender' then LR are going to suffer in sales. I would love it if someone from LR came on here, right here on this thread, and explained to simple gimps like me why it takes so long to produce a rather simple 4x4.

Post #593753 17th Jan 2017 8:55am
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GREENI



Member Since: 22 Aug 2010
Location: staffs
Posts: 7240

United Kingdom 1985 Defender 90 V8 Petrol ST Auto Keswick Green

It took me 2 years to re- build just one!!! Bespoke? One-off?
@v8_ninety

Post #593758 17th Jan 2017 9:16am
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Wild Card 90



Member Since: 03 Dec 2014
Location: Gerlingen
Posts: 845

England 2012 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 SW Indus Silver

To begin with, I too am frustrated at how long LR is taking to replace the Defender.

However, I do have a little insight into how big companies deal with such challenges.

Evolution is great. Not inventing the wheel again and having a heritage to build on makes the job easier. Only changing parts that need to be improved keeps the cost of development down. The been-counters love that. The customer likes it too. He can follow without too much effort, and can quickly identify with the newest version of a product. Something he recognises combined with something he may well find useful.

Eventually it catches up with you, and the areas that need to be changed encompass the whole of the vehicle. There is nothing on the current Defender that can be carried over onto a 2018, 2020 or 2022 Defender. Not one bolt!

Time for a white sheet of paper.

Take a look at a racing series, like F1. Why did Tyrrell build a 6 wheeler, Brabham the fan car or Lotus the twin chassis. Simply put. If you only copy the leading car, you can only be as fast as the leader.... but not faster.

Do things differently, take chances and break new ground. In F1, it has worked again and again.

In an even more expensive arena, building a modern production vehicle, the money spent has to come back in, eventually. No tax dodging sponsor, to swallow the loss.

A modern motor vehicle costs upwards of 2 billion GBP to develop, and that has to recovered before a cent of profit is made, within 6 - 8 years of sales.

Building a complete new and competitve vehicle that looks like the old one is possible, to a degree. This appears to be Mercedes approach with the new G and has been Jeepīs approach. Alot on here would like it, but not enough to sell 50000 (fifty thousand) units a year. When a new model comes on the market, a manufacturer like BMW, Porsche or LR can expect to sell upwards of eighty thousand X6, Cayenne or Range Rovers, for a number of years.

Making the new Defender look like the state of the art answer to the "off road vehicle" question, will attract buyers from age groups and cultures that havenīt had the privilage a "Series on the farm" upbringing, or seen Daktari as a kid.

Looking at the DC100 five years on, I think the LR will show us an amazing new vehicle which will nail the market. The DC100 has a lot of Defender dna, It will still take us a while to get used to it, but that is a good thing. If it is properly robust and capable, we will like it all the more, for it.

Just my two cents worth.
Stephen 1998 Tdi 90 SW,
2008 Td4 90 SW,
2012 2.2 90 SW,
2" raised Trailmaster/Terrafirma
Heavy Track Raids, 255 MTīs,
Recaro CSīs, anorak, wellingtons

Post #593773 17th Jan 2017 10:30am
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AndrewS



Member Since: 10 Apr 2007
Location: Pembridge
Posts: 3021

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 130 Puma 2.2 SW Rimini Red

^^^ Agreed. I think the new Defender in all its options is going to dominate the world's 4x4 SUV market. 130's have feeling's as well you know Smile

Post #593792 17th Jan 2017 12:01pm
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discomog



Member Since: 09 May 2015
Location: Notts/Lincs Border
Posts: 496

United Kingdom 2015 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Santorini Black

Yes Land Rover should have had a policy of continual development and evolution with the Defender but they didn't and the model is now consigned to the history of great British classics. As a Morgan fan as well as a Land Rover fan I know that JLR could have taken a similar approach to Morgan by keeping its loyal fan base whilst evolving their product, introducing air bags and using aerospace technology to incorporate composite aluminium chassis and body parts. However Morgan only make 14 cars a week so maybe not a wise comparison.

On the other hand JLR have released a number of new models over the last few years and all of them have been dominant in their various SUV sectors, Range Rover Sport, Range Rover Evoque, Disco 3 and 4, Disco Sport and the newly announced Disco 5 which will no doubt take more accolades. So on the whole JLR's track record has been to produce winner after winner and I have no doubt that when the new Defender is introduced it will also be a success - no it won't have a chassis and yes it will be bursting with electronics but I'm confident it will be the best 4 x 4 x far. Santorini 90XS SW
Discovery Sport
Morgan Plus 8

Post #593796 17th Jan 2017 12:30pm
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blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 6859

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey

AndrewS wrote:
^^^ Agreed. I think the new Defender in all its options is going to dominate the world's 4x4 SUV market.


I agree, it will be a world beater as an SUV.

I'm just not quite so sure it will be a Defender, I think that the commercial, austere, rugged, truck-based foundation will have gone, and I don't expect to see a platform for cherry-pickers, snowploughs, light armoured vehicles, etc, based on the new one.

Post #593808 17th Jan 2017 1:54pm
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What puddle?



Member Since: 25 Oct 2013
Location: Reading
Posts: 495

United Kingdom 1998 Defender 90 V8 Petrol 50th Auto Atlantis Blue

Sorry, but I cannot be as uncritical of JLR as you all when it comes to the Defender. I have other criticisms of JLR too, like its failure to produce a Mokka-sized/type car/its eagerness to drop the Freelander. The Evoque I love, but couldn't ever buy one as I think it's over-priced. I would feel like I've been done over. The boxy Disco 3 and 4 I loved - can't stand the abomination that is the current one. However, it is with the time it is taken to produce the new Defender that I hold my biggest criticism for - it's just pathetic. They knew for years and years that it would have to be replaced. It IS Land Rover - yet Land Rover no longer have the vehicle that makes it so! The new one should have replaced the old one while the old one was still going! It's likely to be FIVE YEARS for crying out loud! That's just a joke - nothing short of pathetic. Like I have said before, I found nothing wrong with the DC100 apart from the grille. I STILL think it could have been great. But hey, what do I know, I'm just a plumber!

Post #593815 17th Jan 2017 2:38pm
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AndrewS



Member Since: 10 Apr 2007
Location: Pembridge
Posts: 3021

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 130 Puma 2.2 SW Rimini Red

The replacement will be the DC100 all be it a few basic alterations.
I think the delay is partly intended. By the time it's out us flat earthers will have moved on. So when the new vehicle is launched and hated by the flat earthers it will be quieter for them. 130's have feeling's as well you know Smile

Post #593821 17th Jan 2017 2:56pm
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What puddle?



Member Since: 25 Oct 2013
Location: Reading
Posts: 495

United Kingdom 1998 Defender 90 V8 Petrol 50th Auto Atlantis Blue

If that's true, that the DC100 is virtually it, then things are FAR worse than I have said! How can it take them all those years to alter the DC100??? I would at least think that it's not going to be anything like the DC100. If it were, it would have been out for some time now. I'm fully expecting something that is a world away from the DC100.

Post #593861 17th Jan 2017 5:35pm
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AndrewS



Member Since: 10 Apr 2007
Location: Pembridge
Posts: 3021

United Kingdom 2013 Defender 130 Puma 2.2 SW Rimini Red

This is what you are getting perhaps with a few trim alterations. Ps ignore the rear x member on the green one it's been photoshoped.




Click image to enlarge
 130's have feeling's as well you know Smile

Post #593866 17th Jan 2017 6:08pm
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Huttopia



Member Since: 23 Feb 2016
Location: West Midlands
Posts: 484

United Kingdom 1996 Defender 90 300 Tdi PU Portofino Red

The volume of sales doesn't justify prioritising the effort to replace the Defender over working on the D5 or updating the Evoque etc. It's a hospital job.

Post #593868 17th Jan 2017 6:24pm
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Wild Card 90



Member Since: 03 Dec 2014
Location: Gerlingen
Posts: 845

England 2012 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 SW Indus Silver

What they showed us in 2011 was a stying model. It was quite possibly dimensionally correct, but that is about it. My guess is that what has happened in the industry and the worldwide attitude change to the motor vehicle, have caused LR to rethink their plan.

They have lost time doing so, but possibly, as Andrew suggested, will turn this into a bonus factor. 1998 Tdi 90 SW,
2008 Td4 90 SW,
2012 2.2 90 SW,
2" raised Trailmaster/Terrafirma
Heavy Track Raids, 255 MTīs,
Recaro CSīs, anorak, wellingtons

Post #593916 17th Jan 2017 8:54pm
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spudfan



Member Since: 10 Sep 2007
Location: Co Donegal
Posts: 2261

Ireland 

AndrewS wrote:
This is what you are getting perhaps with a few trim alterations. Ps ignore the rear x member on the green one it's been photoshoped.




Click image to enlarge

Side on the bonnet area looks like a Pajero. Can't see the spare wheel being mounted that high on the rear door, there would be no view out of the rear window. 1982 88" 2.25 diesel
1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali
2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu
2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai

Post #594604 19th Jan 2017 11:39pm
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spudfan



Member Since: 10 Sep 2007
Location: Co Donegal
Posts: 2261

Ireland 

I came across this on a link on the AULRO site. It's a good read.
http://www.exploringoverland.com/overland-...g-however- 1982 88" 2.25 diesel
1992 110 200tdi csw -Zikali
2008 110 2.4 tdci csw-Zulu
2011 110 2.4 tdci csw-Masai

Post #594606 19th Jan 2017 11:53pm
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