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| Lambley Member Since: 20 Apr 2013 Location: Mid Devon Posts: 1435   
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I had similar issues, Wrangler Duratrac's on Zu's, after fitting I wasnt happy with the balance (mainly because I thought my mates old balance machine might have needed a recalibration) so I tried balance weights from Devon 4x4. They seemed kind of ok for a while but at certain speeds it got a bit of a wobble, so I decided to take the plunge and get them rebalanced and the tracking done too. Straight after balancing I noticed a big difference, it was much better, no issues at all, 3 of the wheels have got around 50/60g and 2 at around 150 ish. To be honest I'd much rather have a few extra weights than a shudder at around 50-60mph.
Here's the thread ... http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic29747-45.html |
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8th Mar 2015 6:52am |
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| rallysteve Member Since: 10 Feb 2014 Location: Cumbria Posts: 2200 
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Got dynabeads in out 255/85R16 on boosts
No other weights or balancing and they are spot on! Did you make sure the inside of the tyres was clean and free of tyre soap befoobefore installing? Steve 02' 110 TD5 Double Cab Rebuild Thread 84' 90 3.9 V8 Caged Pickup Build Thread - Now For Sale |
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8th Mar 2015 9:35am |
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| K9F Member Since: 12 Nov 2009 Location: Bournemouth Posts: 9610 
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Two things spring to mind.....
You could have gone for the smaller beads and a valve adaptor that negates breaking the tyre bead. Dynabeads who do nothing else but beads recommend 177 grammes not 150 grammes for a tyre of your size. To me it sounds like you do not have enough fitted? Just about to head down the same route and require 225 grammes per tyre for my size. 
http://www.dynabeads.co.uk/dynabeads_4x4.php If you go through life with your head in the sand....all people will see is an ar5e!! Treat every day as if it is your last....one day you will be right!! |
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8th Mar 2015 9:46am |
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| ozzie1989 Member Since: 25 Feb 2009 Location: Wales Posts: 282  
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Lambley, thanks for that. I had seen that thread a while ago but just re-read it, seems a mixed bag of reviews!
Steve, yes we made sure the inside was clean as much as we could - this was one of the things I had read on a post here somewhere! K9F I was wondering if I had enough, to be honest 150g felt like nothing in my hand and I had my doubts (as did my mate)! Unfortunately the Magnabeads you can't apply through the valve stem, which leads me to another question! If the Magnabeads and Dynabeads are similar, could I purchase some of the small Dynabeads and add via the valve core - or do you think it wouldn't be a good idea to mix the two? Thanks for all your help guys!!!  Now: 2010 2.4 TDCi 110 Utility Wagon
Then: 2004 2.5 TD5 90 Hard Top (X-Tech Edition) |
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8th Mar 2015 10:20am |
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| K9F Member Since: 12 Nov 2009 Location: Bournemouth Posts: 9610
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Reading Lambley's issues and the fact he too bought from D4X4 according to the chart by Dynabeads reckoning he too was an ounce short of what was required for his tyre size?
Give them a ring at Dynabeads as they are specialists. Whilst D4X4 beads are cheaper and as a result tempting, the charts and amount required from each supplier differ somewhat with regards to recommended amount/weights for each tyre size. I spoke to both D4X4 and Dynabeads a while ago and found them both very helpful and informative. Dynabeads came out on top, they would be able to advise about mixing the beads, however on the face of it IMHO it doesn't seem a good idea having two differing weights/sizes of bead jockeying for position in your tyre? I'm only going for the larger 4X4 beads as the tyres will be new and wheels refurbished. The smaller beads through the valve stem are a good idea if you wish to bin your weights on an existing tyre/wheel combo and don't wish to remove the wheel or break the bead. Buy one more 150 gramme bag from D4X4 and increase the weight in each tyre would perhaps be your easiest route, or maybe Lambley's still got some beads knocking about? Make a phonecall first. If you go through life with your head in the sand....all people will see is an ar5e!!
Treat every day as if it is your last....one day you will be right!! |
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8th Mar 2015 10:54am |
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| Lambley Member Since: 20 Apr 2013 Location: Mid Devon Posts: 1435
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I think I could have done with a heavier bag of weights in mine, I guess the type of tyre matters a fair amount, the more aggressive tread patterns must be harder to balance, if it was 'normal' road/car tyre tread then I'm sure they would have worked, to be honest I gave up on them after about 3 months or so. I did have the advantage of having the use of a mates tyre machine so I thought I'd give them a go, don't get me wrong, I'm sure they do work in most instances, it just seemed as though 2 of my wheels/tyres were totally different to the others which probably didn't help. If you do persevere I'd stick with the same bead type and size, just go to your local fitter and get them to pop the bead on one side, drop in en extra 50 or 100g per wheel and see how you go.
I don't have any beads left, mine ended up all over the floor in the tyre fitters! |
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8th Mar 2015 1:27pm |
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| ozzie1989 Member Since: 25 Feb 2009 Location: Wales Posts: 282
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Thanks guys!
I will ring D44 in the morning and see what they say, otherwise it may be to purchase some additional beads to try first. I did read one thread where one guy did manage to put some of the Magna Beads in through the stem, but apparently it took ages. Maybe worth me getting another bag and trying that first, save my mate the time as he's super busy at the moment. Failing that I think I will take them out and go back to the usual method to get it as close as possible. Now: 2010 2.4 TDCi 110 Utility Wagon Then: 2004 2.5 TD5 90 Hard Top (X-Tech Edition) |
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8th Mar 2015 9:36pm |
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| ozzie1989 Member Since: 25 Feb 2009 Location: Wales Posts: 282
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Spoke to D44 this morning, very helpful I must say!
Basically they advised against me adding any more weight as too much balance weight can cause the same issues. They were suprised that they wouldn't balance as the Boost alloys are one of the easiest to balance. They also had a set fitted in the workshop at the time and with normal weights only needed 60-80g to balance, so maybe I have a particularly bad set of tyres. What they advised me to do was to 'reset' the beads, as what I didn't know is that they will 'electrostatically' stick to the tyre where needed and not all of them will fall to the bottom when you stop. I think I can confirm this as they were very noisy when rolling them after installing the beads and now they are quite quiet. To do this they advised me to either kick (with appropriate steel footwear of course) or use a rubber mallet or something to shock the tyres and this will cause the beads to fall again. Got to be worth a shot I suppose! Failing that I may rotate the tyres front to back to see what happens, and may even try the spare. Now: 2010 2.4 TDCi 110 Utility Wagon Then: 2004 2.5 TD5 90 Hard Top (X-Tech Edition) |
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9th Mar 2015 10:37am |
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| ozzie1989 Member Since: 25 Feb 2009 Location: Wales Posts: 282
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As I suspected it doesn't work.
My next action is to swap the tyres front to back, and then corner to corner if no improvement. Failing that I'm seriously considering splitting the tyres, selling them and the rims and buying a complete set ready balanced on modulars. If I knew it would be this much hassle I would have done that in the first place!  Now: 2010 2.4 TDCi 110 Utility Wagon
Then: 2004 2.5 TD5 90 Hard Top (X-Tech Edition) |
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11th Mar 2015 3:00pm |
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| Devon-Rover Member Since: 22 Jan 2015 Location: South Devon Posts: 907 
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Sounds like a mare of a problem... No offence to your friend but have you tried another balancing machine to see if it was correct and to get the tyres and rims re balanced? you might have a case where you have to break the bead and rotate the tyre around the rim to even out the difference in the rim versus the tyre.
Hope your sorted soon. |
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11th Mar 2015 3:48pm |
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| K9F Member Since: 12 Nov 2009 Location: Bournemouth Posts: 9610
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I agree with the last post and have just ordered my beads yesterday and mentioned your plight. The beads shouldn't electrostatically stick anywhere. Are you 100% sure there is not a surplus of 'tyre soap' that the beads may be adhering to within the tyres and/or you have enough within them? As mentioned the charts between Devon and Dynabeads differ for your tyre size by an ounce per tyre. Good luck with the rotation.
If you go through life with your head in the sand....all people will see is an ar5e!!
Treat every day as if it is your last....one day you will be right!! |
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11th Mar 2015 3:51pm |
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| ozzie1989 Member Since: 25 Feb 2009 Location: Wales Posts: 282
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Thanks both - it is a bit of a mare! My time is at a premium at the moment too.
I've learnt something else today too, I have white dots on the sidewalls of the tyre, painted on. Looks like they should be aligned with the valve stem according to Cooper Tyres. They are found on many 'premium' tyres apparently. If it's RED it should be opposite the valve stem, any other colour should be aligned with it. I am tempted to get the tyres off, remove beads and start again. My mate isn't available for a few weeks as he's off on Holiday so looks like I'll have to shell out for a garage. I just need to find someone who's willing to spend the time and not a rushed job!!! I'd love to be able to break them myself at home, maybe with the white dots aligned it will be a lot better. Or am I just blindly hoping? Now: 2010 2.4 TDCi 110 Utility Wagon Then: 2004 2.5 TD5 90 Hard Top (X-Tech Edition) |
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11th Mar 2015 5:48pm |
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| Devon-Rover Member Since: 22 Jan 2015 Location: South Devon Posts: 907
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If you were closer ozzie then I would of offered to break them down, remount and rebalance them at work.
Good Luck. |
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11th Mar 2015 11:52pm |
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| ozzie1989 Member Since: 25 Feb 2009 Location: Wales Posts: 282
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Hello all, a final update from me. Sorry it's a bit long...
Had a reply from Magnum regarding the beads, they said with knobbly 4x4 tyres they recommend I put them on a balancing machine and add 'some' weight to the centre of the wheel to help??? Tried to break the beads myself on Friday using a hi-lift jack - no chance with these tyres! Lifted the front of my 110 up on the beads and they still wouldn't break! Guess that's testament to the tyres... Fed up with the situation I visited a tyre place in Cardiff I used to use years ago, one of the guys who owned it was involved in development of 4x4 tyres (can't remember which ones). He's moved on now, but the garage continues with his family. They have some fantastic Hunter equipment there, their 4-wheel alignment rigs are impressive. Equally their tyre balancers are a lot more sophisticated than the one in my mates van. I'd already agreed to strip each wheel, remove beads and re-balance. First up we put a tyre on the machine and the values changed dramatically each time due to the beads. So it's not really possible to 'balance' a tyre with beads in. Second we stripped each tyre which revealed that there was no tyre paste in any tyres and the beads were free flowing etc. Henry the hoover had fun removing all the beads! Next we re-mounted each tyre with the white dot on the sidewall in line with the valve and balanced - to be honest we found this white dot method only made a little difference to the figures. 4 of the tyres required 120-140g on the outside and 30-50g on the inside. Using stick on weights placed strategically we achieved this well. 1 tyre however needed over 250g of weight on the outside and about 80g inside (pic below) - no amount of rotating the tyre on the rim helped so I can only assume either the wheel or tyre is dodgy. We did manage to balance it and needless to say this went back on as my spare. Hopefully I'll never have to use it, but if I do hopefully those weights will have stayed in place.  Click image to enlarge The landy is back to normal now, smooth as silk at all speeds. Total cost: £90 for 2 hours work, and £30 wasted on the beads, total £120 wasted! Lesson learnt, don't try to balance difficult tyres on a mobile tyre van and don't use beads Now: 2010 2.4 TDCi 110 Utility Wagon
Then: 2004 2.5 TD5 90 Hard Top (X-Tech Edition) |
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16th Mar 2015 3:38pm |
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