 | Home > Off Topic > Any Disco 2 experts - ACE removal |
 
|
|
|
| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16884   
|
Don't believe the rumours and old wives' tales, believe the facts:-
1) ACE is a good feature and enhances the vehicle. 2) The most common problem (in fact about the only one you ever hear about) with the ACE is that the rigid pipes develop rust pinholes and leak, or the flexible hoses weep. The most common ones to fail are the two pipes from the valve block to the rear actuator and the HP pipe from the pump to the valve block (which has actually just started leaking on mine). Very occasionally you will get actuators that leak. 3) There is no reason why someone who is halfway competent cannot replace any component of the ACE system, inlcuding the pipes, pump, and actuators. It isn't difficult. 4) The rigid pipes are expensive - the HP pipe from the puimp to the VB (the one I am about to replace) is in two parts and will cost about £150 + VAT for the pair. The old one has lasted 12 years and 200k miles so owes me nothing. The standard repair time for replacing this pipe is 2 hours, so if I took it to a dealer it woudl probably cost about £400 to £500 + VAT. I suppose that that could be considered a big bill. 5) A new valve block would be expensive but there are plenty of 2nd hand ones and you very infrequently hear of them being needed. 6) If you replace any of the pipes from the valve block to the actuators or the actuators themselves you really need a diagnostic system (such as Faultmate, Testbook, etc) to bleed the system. Upstream of the valve block (ie HP pipe from pump to VB, LP return from VB to reservoir, and LP from reservoir to pump) you do not. Many people talk about removing the system (whcih involves replacing the anti-roll bars, removing the pump and fitting an idler pulley in its place) rather than fixing a leak. Why remove a £1000 option just becuase a pipe needs replacing? If you're buying a Disco2 with ACE, then check the pipes for rust and build-ups of dirt/mud etc which will encourage rust. If you have a choice, choose the one with the best pipework (which will also usually have the best chassis). Also check the actuators for signs of leakage (although the fornt one will be covered in the same fliud if the steering box is leaking, so check the reservoir to see if it's ACE fluid or PAS fluid (conjoined but seperate reservoirs are used, both take PAS fluid). I can understand people removing air suspension from a Disco, but not removing ACE. Incidentally my Disco is a 2002 TD5 GS5, it is 12 years old and has done over 200k miles. It has recently developed a tiny leak of ACE fluid somewhere between the pump and the steering box area, which is squirting fluid into the cooling fan and it is going everywhere! The fluid loss is very slow - from max to min on the reservoir in maybe 250 miles. This is the first defect that it has ever had with the ACE - it has been a very reliable system until now. Editted repeatedly for some of the many spelling errors! |
||
20th May 2014 2:39pm |
|
| smb Member Since: 15 Jan 2013 Location: Cheshire Posts: 1232 
|
As Blackwolf recommends
I decided, stupidly, to remove the ACE off my Disco 2 TD5. The two pipes BW refers to had pinhole leaks which became evident when under work. However, the Block was knackered and the replacement was over £ 1000.00 part only so that was the incentive to remove it and fit ARB's. It does the job, just not as well and I wish I had taken the gamble of getting some 2nd hand replacement parts instead. Someone on the Disco2 Forum did mention that as it was not approved there may be issues in taking it off and replacing with a different system from an insurance point of view in the case of a serious accident. Don't know how true that would be, but its a choice we make. |
||
|
20th May 2014 3:20pm |
|
| MartinK Member Since: 02 Mar 2011 Location: Silverdale (Lancashire/Cumbria Border) Posts: 2664 
|
Hmmm
A slightly different point from me, a contrast to blackwolf and smb's comments rather than a disagreement... ACE is very useful if your GS is 7-seat. Most 7-seat variants had self-leveling rear suspension (air bags). If you have SLS, then the ACE is indeed a very useful piece of kit. It'll wallow in corners without ACE if you have SLS. ACE is almost redundant with a coil-sprung Disco 2 (usually a 5-seat), and removing ACE does not damage handling significantly if you have coil springs. As mentioned above, the common place for the leak is just in front of the actuator box under the driver's door. You should be able to see 4 pipes attached to the chassis behind the drivers side front wheel. They go into a box under the drivers door attached to the chassis. It's here the pipes get peppered by road grit when you're driving. Problem is that if one pipe's goner, then it's likely the others aren't far behind. Replacement pipes from LR are expensive (when I removed my ACE, they were around £80 per pipe, and there's around 8 in the system). If you're a home DIY-er, you can replace the faulty pipe - a more common fix is to replace the section with some pipe and a pipe flange kit... If you remove ACE (not a bad idea on a coil-sprung, less advisable on a SLS IMHO)...As well as removing the pipes, reprogramming the "brain" to tell it there's no ACE, you also need non-ACE roll-bar(s) (I only added a front ARB, never put an ARB on the rear) and to remove the ACE pump. The ACE pump is at the front of the motor and driven by the aux drive belt. When the ACE pump is removed you need a jockey wheel in it's place - a good time to put the new aux drive belt on at the same time... Either way, don't drive far without fluid in the ACE system - if the ace pump siezes, then the aux drive belt gets into trouble - could be VERY expensive! My two-penneth, dump ACE if you have coils, keep it if you have SLS. (or remove SLS and ACE at the same time, and go for a basic coil system)... PS - I removed ACE from my own 5-Seater GS, and it was fine for years after. Somewhere on LandyZone, or LR4x4 there's a write-up done by me (MartinK) from about 4 years ago, but I can't find it now - I am sure I even gave the part numbers for the aux drive jockey wheel... There are also 2 part numbers for the aux drive belt IIRC, on with and one without ACE... Defender "Puma" 2.4 110 County Utility (possibly the last of the 2.4's) |
||
|
20th May 2014 5:16pm |
|
| blackwolf Member Since: 03 Nov 2009 Location: South West England Posts: 16884
|
My Disco is a 5 seater on coils. I have driven mine (with ACE) and others which left the factory without ACE (so correct non-ACE springs and dampers) and I know which I prefer! I wouldn't myself buy one which had had ACE removed under any circumstances. Personal preference, of course.
The object on the chassis rail beneath the driver's seat is the valve block, not an actuator. It only gets splattered if the front offside mudflap is missing. The actuators are fitted to the ARBs. I agree that as a generalisation all the steel pipes will tend to be in similar condition. In my experience vehicles which have been covered in mud, manure, salt, etc may tend to have rusty pipes. They also probably have rusty chassis. If you buy a neglected vehicle, expect problems (and not just from the ACE). Bottom line you have nothing to fear from ACE, and it is a good feature. If you have problems then you have the option to remove it, you have the option to repair it. Make sure that you visually check the pipes when considering purchase, and look for obvious signs of neglect. Make your decision based on judgement. There are plenty of other potential problems on a Disco 2 which are more hassle than the ACE! |
||
|
20th May 2014 5:39pm |
|
| DefenderJon Member Since: 01 Dec 2012 Location: Sunny Ulster Posts: 68  
|
I had a similar leak when I had a D2 td5. It was a banjo fitting on one of the pipes coming off the pump had come loose. Might be worth checking in your case. Jon. |
||
|
20th May 2014 5:42pm |
|
| Mean Green Member Since: 15 Sep 2011 Location: South Ayrshire Posts: 278 
|
Thanks for all the input guys.
I think the general concensus is that on a cost basis it would not be any cheaper to remove than fix if it all went wrong. My idea had been to offer my '06 Mazda6 estate as a straigh swap for the D2, as much as the Mazda is a great car and has never given me a moment problem it just doesnt have the appeal of a green oval. But I also dont want (another) money pit. So the more I think about it the best thing to do is change SWMBO's Fiesta for a larger "family car" and I can use my 90 for my daily driver. This killing many birds with one stone - 1. We have a family car for holidays etc 2. I get to use the 90 more 3. There is not another green oval product taking my time and money away from the 90. Thanks for the help  |
||
|
21st May 2014 1:19pm |
|
|
|
| All times are GMT + 1 Hour |
< Previous Topic | Next Topic > |
Posting Rules
|
Site Copyright © 2006-2024 Futuranet Ltd & Martin Lewis
