↓ Advertise on Defender2 ↓

Home > Puma TDCi > Temporary turbo failure?
Post Reply  Down to end
Page 1 of 1
Print this entire topic · 
Chopperone



Member Since: 13 Nov 2016
Location: Derbyshire
Posts: 176

United Kingdom 
Temporary turbo failure?

So, I am on the way to the Great British Land Rover Show ( more about that later).
I have a 2007 TdCi 90 N; chipped , BAS intercooler. Griffin exhaust - plenty of spooling up noise.
Cruising on the M40 around 70 mph when I felt there was no top end available.
Pretty soon it felt as though the turbo didn’t exist.
So I limp into the show & have a quick peek; all hoses etc etc in order.
I did about 25 miles across country & then 20 miles at a very constant throttle setting.
No warning lights , nothing , zilch.
There was no noise from the turbo at all & a tremendous loss of power.

I walked round the show in 20 mins. I did another circuit & then left.
Everything worked fine no loss of power , all back to normal.
Drove 50 odd miles back home of completely mixed roads. Stopped once to refuel & another time to pick up some stuff.
Never missed a beat.
Any ideas?
Guy May your life be like toilet paper ; long & useful.

Post #667062 26th Nov 2017 5:48pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
grafty99



Member Since: 15 Aug 2012
Location: North Devon
Posts: 2209

United Kingdom 2002 Defender 90 Td5 HT Caledonian Blue

Maybe the early signs of turbo actuator failure? 2002 90 Td5 Hard Top
1990 Vogue SE
Triumph Tiger Explorer 1200
Defender Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic50767.html
RRC Thread http://www.defender2.net/forum/topic54492.html


Last edited by grafty99 on 7th Dec 2017 8:20am. Edited 1 time in total

Post #667073 26th Nov 2017 6:21pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
ickle



Member Since: 22 Jul 2010
Location: BROADWAY
Posts: 1031

United Kingdom 2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 CSW Alpine White

either as above or

harness can fail and there's a kit to extend it

or mine was exactly the same symptoms and it was sooted up variable vanes, I fitted a new tyurbo but there is a spray you can put through the inlet that will clean it - I didn't fancy filling the engine with bits of crud so fitted a new one.

Good luck
Keith

Post #667090 26th Nov 2017 6:55pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 7485

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey

No wastegate on a Puma.

It would be worth checking the engine harness for chafing, since they are notorious for doing this at every point where they are secured to the engine. A broken wire or an intermittent short to ground of the wires to the actuator motor will cause the symptoms you describe.

Post #667118 26th Nov 2017 8:53pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Chopperone



Member Since: 13 Nov 2016
Location: Derbyshire
Posts: 176

United Kingdom 

Strange thing is there were no other signs of the problem, no increase in temp , no black smoke.
I had literally been cruising at a very constant speed through the camera section of the M42 by the NEC.

I’ve got a mate who can read the ecu maybe that’s my next line of attack.
Thanks for everyone’s input.
Guy May your life be like toilet paper ; long & useful.

Post #667169 26th Nov 2017 11:21pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 7485

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey

There is unlikely to be smoke if the actuator has packed up since the ecu will fuel correctly for the volume of air actually passing the manifold, not the volume of air expected through the manifold.

I had the chafed loom problem a couple of years ago and there were no symptoms other than an almost complete loss of power. When I inspected the loom I found one of the feedback wire from the actuator had failed completely, and several other wires were damaged. Most disturbingly the main alternator to battery feed was about halfway through its insulation, and I reckon the actuator failing saved me from a catastrophic vehicle fire, the inevitable outcome of this one earthing.

Post #667192 27th Nov 2017 7:11am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
smb



Member Since: 15 Jan 2013
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 1078

United Kingdom 2011 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Santorini Black

Hi BW,

I don't suppose you have a sketch showing where to inspect the harness/wiring for chaffing or its weak spots(accepting that the whole wiring is a Defender weak spot!!) do you?

Ive been having what appears to be the same issue as chaperone now for the last 2 years. Can drive a thousand miles with no problem then do a hundred mile journey and it happen 3 or 4 times.

It only seems to happen when Im just cruising in 6th doing about 55-65 and then without warning when I try to accelerate nothing happens. The feeling when I start to increase pressure on the accelerator is similar to hitting an immediate headwind. If I'm on a straight level it will very slowly Strat to lose revs. If I'm on a slight incline the revs will go down quicker. Change down to 5th and the same and sometimes even in 4th. It is as if the turbo has given up.

I have to pull over and switch off. Switch back on and it will be good although it may reappear within 5 minutes or not for a couple of weeks.

Many thanks ----------------------------------------------------------
2010 110csw 2.4, 2000 Disco td5, 1948 Series 1 80", 1950 Series 1 80"

Post #667216 27th Nov 2017 9:08am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
blackwolf



Member Since: 03 Nov 2009
Location: South West England
Posts: 7485

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 DCPU Stornoway Grey

It tends to chafe anywhere the harness is secured to the engine or anywhere it touches any part of the engine. I found damage in about 4 places, with the most serious (the broken wires and damaged alternator cable) in the vicinity of the connector for the heater plugs.

The only thorough approach is to cut every cable tie to free the harness from the engine, then inspect every inch. You will find damage to the convoluted trunking and usually damage the harness inside. I rebound most of mine, used new split convoluted tube, and used additional protective sleeving in high-risk areas. I also rerouted it in some places. With the repairs to the damaged conductors it took half a day to do, but there is no doubt that it prevented an imminent vehicle fire when the battery shorted to ground. I was appalled by the general condition of the harness. It's an '07 2.4, btw.

I have since bought 2 spare harnesses for modest sums via eBay and found that both have similar damage. It is my intention to refurbish these as spares.

Post #667229 27th Nov 2017 10:13am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
4wheeler



Member Since: 13 Apr 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 87

Australia 2013 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 SW Chawton White

While I have a 2.2 Defender which runs fine as did my 2.4 Defender, I have a 2.4, 2010 Ford Transit with 225,000 km on it.
Every now and then it loses power through lack of turbo boost. Sometimes a MIL comes on but many times not. The codes vary but it can be turbo under boost or over boost. Pulling over and restarting solves the problem.
Sometimes it will occur a number of times in a short distance and then won't have a problem for many thousands of kilometres. I can always tell when it happens as I always sense a very slight change in the throttle just before things go pear shaped. I run an Ultragauge so can see what's going on and clear codes if required.

Boost jumps to 22 plus PSI in some instances or won't go above 5 PSI in others. It actually does it on one particular hill I drive every 3 months virtually every time I drive up it. A good many times it is hills which induces the problem and never occurs around the stop-start driving around the city. Checked fuel, filters, you name it.

It has had this problem since 130,000 Km. I suspect it is a vane problem such as sticking etc.

It has only been a problem a couple of times when I lost power on the freeway in amongst a whole lot of "B double" trucks doing 100 KM/H. The very first time it lost power I was passing a truck up a long hill, moved in front, then lost power. Luckily I was able to move off the road. Yes, the Ford dealer has looked at it but has not been able to fix it. Probably a new turbo in the future will fix the problem.

Post #667233 27th Nov 2017 10:32am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
pkrynicki1984



Member Since: 06 Dec 2017
Location: stoke on trent
Posts: 7

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 HT Rioja Red
Turbo temp fault

Did you manage to sort this ? sounds exactly what i'm going through right now.

Cheers

Pete

Post #669278 6th Dec 2017 8:41am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Chopperone



Member Since: 13 Nov 2016
Location: Derbyshire
Posts: 176

United Kingdom 

I haven’t driven my Defender this week & when I drove back from Stoneleigh it was absolutely fine.
I have two friends I need to speak to about this.
One works for BorgWarner dealing with turbos for JLR & the other specialises in vehicle Ecu programming , hopefully, between the two of them we can come up with an answer.
Guy May your life be like toilet paper ; long & useful.

Post #669437 6th Dec 2017 10:36pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
pkrynicki1984



Member Since: 06 Dec 2017
Location: stoke on trent
Posts: 7

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 HT Rioja Red

Excellent , please let me know the outcome.

I'll get my plugged in also in the meantime.

Post #669487 7th Dec 2017 8:13am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
M94PUMA



Member Since: 16 Dec 2016
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 38

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 90 Puma 2.4 PU Tonga Green

Sounds like the Manifold Air Pressure sensor. Had exactly the same issues, would loose all power no fault codes or lights. Turn engine off then back on would be perfectly fine. It’s basically thinking the turbo is over boosting and ecu cuts power. The sensor is on the air intake and often gets filled up with oil and crud. I changed mine and havnt had a problem since.

Post #669557 7th Dec 2017 3:56pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
ickle



Member Since: 22 Jul 2010
Location: BROADWAY
Posts: 1031

United Kingdom 2008 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 CSW Alpine White

The next time anyone has this issue, pull over without stopping the engine open the bonnet and get a passenger to rev the engine, on mine the turbo actuator wouldn't move. Switch off re start and it would clear itself.

It started mainly after long runs at constant throttle opening, running to and from the ferries at night. In the end when it got bad I would switch the motor off and back on again without stopping.

A new turbo solved it instantly.

Keith

Post #669594 7th Dec 2017 7:03pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Post Reply
Post Reply  Back to top
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT

Jump to  
Previous Topic | Next Topic >
Posting Rules
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



Site Copyright © 2006-2017 Futuranet Ltd & Martin Lewis