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Bluest



Member Since: 23 Apr 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 670

United Kingdom 2007 Defender 110 Puma 2.4 XS CSW Java Black

If we look across the world, which production cars are close in ethos to the Defender? Not many, I would argue. The 70 series Land Cruiser is probably the nearest thing. Jimny is a bit too compact, not really heavy duty enough. Jeep Wrangler maybe, or is that too leisure orientated? G Wagon is just too expensive.

I suspect the Cruiser sales are propped up by various government contracts and the mining industry, and I wouldn't be surprised is Toyota don't make much money out of it in the grand scheme of things.

All of this suggests to me the new Defender won't be like it was. I suspect they may go for the Jeep Wrangler leisure approach, with the added veneer of premium-ness to justify a high price. That's not to say it will be car like the wrangler, just be chasing the same lifestyle market. 2007 110 TDCi Station Wagon XS

Post #657370 15th Oct 2017 9:44am
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Slideywindows



Member Since: 09 Sep 2016
Location: Essex
Posts: 199

England 

Surely it is possible to keep an existing Defender going for the rest of your life, especially if you are not afflicted with "lust for new"?

A never-ending propaganda wall of "marketing" makes us think that new must be better.

If we ever stop believing this, the economy will collapse.
.

So I'll do "content with the old Defender" on my own then.....

Post #657471 15th Oct 2017 7:57pm
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MGCarr



Member Since: 18 Nov 2016
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 42

United Kingdom 1997 Defender 90 300 Tdi PU Rioja Red

Slideywindows

Count me in for the 'content with the old Defender' club Thumbs Up

Post #657507 15th Oct 2017 10:26pm
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Huttopia



Member Since: 23 Feb 2016
Location: West Midlands
Posts: 605

United Kingdom 1996 Defender 90 300 Tdi PU Portofino Red

And me. Why agonise over what may or may not come next, it won't be closely related to the old Defender so I don't get why it is relevant?

Post #657530 16th Oct 2017 7:19am
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Knoxy



Member Since: 06 May 2013
Location: Ayrshire
Posts: 43

United Kingdom 

My local JLR dealer has just built a huge new plate glass showroom and as I had not been in since it opened, I swung by for a look at what was on offer. My usual contact, who has over 30 years, service selling Land Rovers and runs a Defender that he is no doubt not allowed to park in plain sight of the dealership, was not in, so a young trendy showed me around the range. I have to say, I have never been so uninspired in a car showroom since my mates dad bought a Lada in the 80s. I am not averse to a bit of 4x4 performance, engineering and luxury, running a physics defying Porsche Cayenne for the missus. Everything I saw in the RR / LR showroom, whilst undoubtedly capable, looked like a cross between a DFS interior gone wrong and the extreme bling of a badly executed Luxury hotel in Dubai. Not to mention a collection of rear ends styled after RMS Titanic (Velar & Discovery).

Now although I have owned Defenders for a long time, I am not the archetypal, bobble hat wearing, wood in my beer Defender owner who wants a new Defender to be exactly like the old Defender. I do all my own spanner swinging and have subtly but significantly upgraded my Oct 2015 90 XS Hard Top. I am pretty receptive to a worthy, modern, useable replacement which honours the essence and heritage of the Defender without the exposed spot welds and borderline sadomasochistic driving experience and would probably be at the head of the queue if they got it right. However, I fear that the current product range is so very divorced from the ethos of a Defender that I doubt JLR have any hope of producing anything close to maintaining the spirit of the marque and satisfying the Defender customer base. Meanwhile, the time elapsed has meant that a large chunk of that customer base has simply had to move on (including the Farming community, Utilities, Emergency Services etc).

The young trendy reckoned he had been given a good insight into the Defender replacement during his visits to JLR Corporate and that the Defender replacement was ďlike a Skoda YetiĒ. Now given the bewildered look of confusion and disinterest on his face when I told him I had bought the last production allocation for a Defender that his dealership had back in 2015, Iím not sure if this comparison is positive or negative, as he "loved the current range". Sheep
Part of me believes that the Defender replacement will be allowed to quietly die on the vine, due to insufficient demand or inability to achieve the required premium price tag from the market segment. Alternatively, they will wheel out an overpriced production version of the DC100 concept now that all the WhooHaa has died down.

I live in hope but fear the worst.

Post #657608 16th Oct 2017 1:55pm
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nidge n



Member Since: 04 Feb 2012
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 580

2012 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Orkney Grey

Alas, Iím with you Knoxy. I have two defenders, a 110and a 90Heritage. I wanted to add another LR to the family and use my 110 for lighter duties. I personally donít think the defender will be replaced any time soon so I really wanted the new discovery to work. Gosh, thatís a child only parents could love. The Range Rover line is not aimed at me. Now Iím looking elsewhere which feels strange. But hanging on for a new defender that may just not materialise is not the answer.

Post #657718 16th Oct 2017 7:26pm
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What puddle?



Member Since: 25 Oct 2013
Location: Reading
Posts: 594

United Kingdom 

Sad state of affairs, isn't it? Personally, I would much rather that they had run with the DC100. I liked it, still do. If the new one does look like a Yeti, then that IS the DC100! Apart from the Evoque and the D4, I think LR have done a terrible job - but sales figures indicate I'm wrong, I think. I was once well within their typical-buyers segment. Now, even though I'm wealthier than I've ever been, the entire range is out of my buying league! I really am clinging on to the hope that the Ineos is the natural Defender replacement. I'm disappointed that there have been some negative comments about it here, and shocked, actually, as I would have thought that it is exactly what many who frequent this site are after. They're even asking YOU what you want it to be. Have LR asked you? Britain's population (unofficially) growing at 2,000 people a day - but no one's talking about it. Still want to get old?

Post #657732 16th Oct 2017 8:00pm
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Knoxy



Member Since: 06 May 2013
Location: Ayrshire
Posts: 43

United Kingdom 

I know where you are coming from Nidge. My 90 is a car I drive for fun, so for me needs to be used in the right circumstances and context for it to be so. I just cannot stomach it as a daily driver in rush hour traffic etc, as its shortcomings drive me nuts , so its saved for circumstances when my head and heart is up for it. I dont want to seem pretentious Whistle but I am in the fortunate position to have a few cars to choose from, my dailly driver is one of the last 6 cylinder Caymanís I bought last spring, which I wont run in the winter. I ran the 90 every day last winter and for me it was a toil, therefore I had hoped the new Defender might be available for this year but no. There is nothing in the RR / LR range that I could see myself driving, apart from maybe an outgoing model full size Rangie and to be honest, my head and past experience tells me not to spend that kind of money on a JLR product, even if I could, as it would surely end in aftersales / dealer induced dissapointment.

As such Iím also left looking elsewhere for a winter driver, believe it or not I am flirting with a pre registered Fiat Panda Cross, relatively cheap, capabale, reliable and easy to get out of, if a decent Defender replacement does materialise in the next year or two. Maybe Iíll feel different when the medication wears off. Laughing

Post #657750 16th Oct 2017 8:31pm
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apt100



Member Since: 05 Mar 2015
Location: Derbyshire
Posts: 1322

United Kingdom 2016 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Aintree Green

What puddle? wrote:
They're even asking YOU what you want it to be. Have LR asked you?


Yes. On a postcard during the Defender production tour.
Of course, a cynic might think they all went straight in the bin Whistle

Post #657752 16th Oct 2017 8:35pm
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Knoxy



Member Since: 06 May 2013
Location: Ayrshire
Posts: 43

United Kingdom 

After the recent treatment I received from my Main Dealer and JLR which lead to me immediately selling my 2015 Defender, I dont give a Flying Feck what the next Defender will be like as it will be a Cold Day in Hell before JLR gets another penny of my hard earned cash. Twisted Evil

End of Rant!

Post #664241 14th Nov 2017 3:14pm
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Panda



Member Since: 29 May 2015
Location: Essex
Posts: 431

England 2015 Defender 110 Puma 2.2 XS CSW Fuji White

Sorry to here that Knoxy. Happy motoring whatever you choose

Thumbs Up Monty-2015 2.2 110 XS Puma Station Wagon
Yoda Disco 3-Sold
Larry Disco 1-Sold
Muddly XS 90 TDCI-Sold
Pearl Disco 2-Sold
Larry Disco 1-didn't want too but sold

Post #664262 14th Nov 2017 3:56pm
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What puddle?



Member Since: 25 Oct 2013
Location: Reading
Posts: 594

United Kingdom 

I hear you, Knoxy. Trouble is, bad service (if that's what you got) is everywhere - everywhere! Me and Mrs Puddle are getting really fed up with terrible service from big name companies. And no, not just British ones, but Italian ones (Smeg) too. Been without a dishwasher (under warranty) for three weeks now. Britain's population (unofficially) growing at 2,000 people a day - but no one's talking about it. Still want to get old?

Post #664292 14th Nov 2017 5:18pm
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Knoxy



Member Since: 06 May 2013
Location: Ayrshire
Posts: 43

United Kingdom 

Very true. Its as though the rush towards Globalisation, Low Cost Manufacturing and consumers expectation of ever cheaper stuff, resulting in a lack of customer loyalty has caused companies to devalue the service they offer.

There are some exceptions but they are very rare, typically customer service is in the Censored .

Off topic but on white goods Iím a big fan of Miele, their aproach is still to design and build bombproof quality that does not break and so no customer service required. Properly expensive though.

Post #664307 14th Nov 2017 5:42pm
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What puddle?



Member Since: 25 Oct 2013
Location: Reading
Posts: 594

United Kingdom 

We're thoroughly sick of it - B&M, B&Q, Smeg, Pop Telecom, Workwear Express - just one rotten experience after another. It just makes you not want to buy anything, because you know it'll go titsup. Just had another today: Bought a cordless circular saw from Screwfix (usually good) and got it home to find no blade included, no carry-case(!), and the battery on the other (same make) tools doesn't fit. Fed up Evil or Very Mad Britain's population (unofficially) growing at 2,000 people a day - but no one's talking about it. Still want to get old?

Post #664312 14th Nov 2017 6:01pm
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Morepower



Member Since: 08 Jan 2013
Location: Fife, Scotland
Posts: 444

New Zealand 2016 Defender 90 Puma 2.2 HT Corris Grey

TBH.... This is where I think we're heading.... Rolling with laughter



Click image to enlarge



Enjoy

Tim It doesn't matter how bad it is, It can always get worse...

Post #665522 19th Nov 2017 4:47pm
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